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hmmm....
 

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Because some people just don't understand Supply and Demand. If I were a company that built these products, I'd be alll over the R18 instead of the k20. There is practically no competition, and it seems like there is a bigger thirst for power amongst R18 owners instead of the K20 owners.
 

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because most people who buy R18's arent looking for performance while guys with k20's are usually looking to up their ponies.
 

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You have a very valid point dude, however think of the MAJORITY of the people who drive R18-equipped cars. Obviously not the people in this thread, but the majority of the people bought the base for it's fuel economy.

For as long as I can remember, base Civic's didn't respond well to aftermarket mods. The R18A1, does fare well however.
 

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I Vtec said:
Because some people just don't understand Supply and Demand. If I were a company that built these products, I'd be alll over the R18 instead of the k20. There is practically no competition, and it seems like there is a bigger thirst for power amongst R18 owners instead of the K20 owners.

I would have that same thirst if i was down 60 hp to an Si too.

Engines that are built for fuel economy were never intended to make more power. I would like to see some statistics on demand for R18 power parts and K20 power parts. I would think that the K20 owners want more power because there is A LOT more room for more power. R18 owners are trying to squeeze water out of a rock.
 

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Sirbelch said:
I would have that same thirst if i was down 60 hp to an Si too.

Engines that are built for fuel economy were never intended to make more power. I would like to see some statistics on demand for R18 power parts and K20 power parts. I would think that the K20 owners want more power because there is A LOT more room for more power. R18 owners are trying to squeeze water out of a rock.
True, but it can work the other way as well.

I had an LX (06) and all I wanted was more oomph out of it. Now I have an SI, and I'm content with the power. See how that works? I find the SI to be quick enough already to be fun, but if I still had my LX, I'd be dieing for every little pony I could gain.

And I hate that dumb argument of 'xxx motor was never intended to make more power'. I SERIOUSLY doubt the K-series is built to make more power, it's just built well enough that it can handle it. It's not like they sat around in the designing room and said "Hey, lets make sure this motor can handle 450 WHP because everyone is gonna boost the hell out of it". Plenty of SOHC civics with built motors will whip the hell out of mine and your SI front and backwards.
 

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Sirbelch said:
I would have that same thirst if i was down 60 hp to an Si too.

Engines that are built for fuel economy were never intended to make more power. I would like to see some statistics on demand for R18 power parts and K20 power parts. I would think that the K20 owners want more power because there is A LOT more room for more power. R18 owners are trying to squeeze water out of a rock.

lmao water out of a rock lol its so true
 

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at least were working with what we got....
 

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Sirbelch said:
I would have that same thirst if i was down 60 hp to an Si too.

Engines that are built for fuel economy were never intended to make more power. I would like to see some statistics on demand for R18 power parts and K20 power parts. I would think that the K20 owners want more power because there is A LOT more room for more power. R18 owners are trying to squeeze water out of a rock.
Who's to say theres no room for power in the R18?

Cant really know till you try.
 

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^^^:yeahthat: :yeahthat:

But even if there's significantly less room for power, that doesn't mean we don't deserve to

Personally, if (and I do believe this is true) we can with moderate effort get 20-25 whp out of our cars without compromising the economy of it, I think there would be a HUGE market for it.

For example, already we have:

- CAI/SRI sets
- Pulleys
- Catbacks (though gains and economy compromises are debatable)

But there are three things that Si owners have access to that would get bought up like gangbusters if offerd for the R18

- TB Spacer
- IM Gasket
- Reflash

Why is there no development for these items even though the cars have been available for 2+ years? It's the misconception that people who bought an R18 aren't interested in performance.

But that's a misconception. R18 owners are interested in performance. They are just MORE interested in economy (both in MPG and purchase price). I think there are a number of R18 owners out there that aren't interested in racing their cars (legally or otherwise), but would like to have a little more power. Just so the R18 can live up to it's full potential.

Personally, I could've easily afforded an Si, but I drove stick for 3 years and got sick of it, and my wife can't drive stick, so it'd be a me-only car (not that my EX 2dr isn't now :biggrin: ). So me, I'd love to have enough more power just that my car doesn't FEEL like an economy car when I drive it.

Another thing I'm jealous of is the X-Mod. We really need a good, simple, effective, inexpensive way to mod the stock intake to be more efficient.

I guess I just resent the implication that everyone who bought an R18 was only interested in MPG or was just too poor, dumb, or cheap to pop for the Si . . . . and therefore, any performance concerns for the R18 should be written off.
 

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The way I see it people spend thousands on turbo's for the R18's etc when you could of put that money to buy the Si and had a way better car to start off with ,motor,tranny, looks but people that have the R18's doing bolt on's Im not even going to be a hipacrite (however you spell it :p) I would do the same.
 

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hypocrite would be the word your looking for.
I think the economy thing becomes moot also once you start turboing an R18 because you get to where we are at hp wise and you start to lose MPG and have to turn to Premium gasoline also, where us k20's get close to R18 mileage (if you stay out vtec and dont go crazy all the time). I mean that economy house kind of gets too small once you start building that engine.
 

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Did anyone say anything about turbos? Turboing an R18 IS stupid. I'm not talking about spending thousands of dollars here. I'm not even talking about trying to be an SI. I'm talking about giving the R18 a little more bite.
 

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Ryan T said:
^^^:yeahthat: :yeahthat:

But even if there's significantly less room for power, that doesn't mean we don't deserve to

Personally, if (and I do believe this is true) we can with moderate effort get 20-25 whp out of our cars without compromising the economy of it, I think there would be a HUGE market for it.

For example, already we have:

- CAI/SRI sets
- Pulleys
- Catbacks (though gains and economy compromises are debatable)

But there are three things that Si owners have access to that would get bought up like gangbusters if offerd for the R18

- TB Spacer
- IM Gasket
- Reflash

Why is there no development for these items even though the cars have been available for 2+ years? It's the misconception that people who bought an R18 aren't interested in performance.

But that's a misconception. R18 owners are interested in performance. They are just MORE interested in economy (both in MPG and purchase price). I think there are a number of R18 owners out there that aren't interested in racing their cars (legally or otherwise), but would like to have a little more power. Just so the R18 can live up to it's full potential.

Personally, I could've easily afforded an Si, but I drove stick for 3 years and got sick of it, and my wife can't drive stick, so it'd be a me-only car (not that my EX 2dr isn't now :biggrin: ). So me, I'd love to have enough more power just that my car doesn't FEEL like an economy car when I drive it.

Another thing I'm jealous of is the X-Mod. We really need a good, simple, effective, inexpensive way to mod the stock intake to be more efficient.

I guess I just resent the implication that everyone who bought an R18 was only interested in MPG or was just too poor, dumb, or cheap to pop for the Si . . . . and therefore, any performance concerns for the R18 should be written off.
A round of applause for you... hmm, no smiley for that.

This shall suffice!! :dancing:
 

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PhalanX said:
A round of applause for you... hmm, no smiley for that.

This shall suffice!! :dancing:
Well there's :claps: but it looks wierd. Thanks. I'm glad I didn't get flamed for that one (yet). :D
 

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I got my r18 for the economy. I wish it had more power, but you get what you pay for here. Cheaper, but better MPG. I have another car that is much faster and more unreliable, but my EX lets me keep it. (You cant have a DD going down all the time, and a gutted 450 hp mustang is hardly a great daily ride). But with that said, there are tons of R18 owners out there where that car is their daily driver, and they would like to make it faster. Saying that you get a SI for performance, and a r18 for economy only is a broad blanket statement. Theres other factors like price, insurance, gas, ect. I would love for my EX to make 160-190 hp. Hopefully someday the market will work for it. Now as for what the limits of what the r18 can realistically make with reasonable mods..I have no idea. I havnt learned enough about the motor yet, or what modifications to a 4 cylinder provide. Im a old v8 guy. :)
 
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