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Hondata announces the FlashPro

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Hondata is pleased to announce a new tuning product - the FlashPro. Initially this will available for the Civic Si and Civic Type R.

The FlashPro allows you to custom tune your Civic Si for aftermarket performance products, including forced induction. Additionally you can datalog, graph & analyze your engine parameters.

Out of the box features which you will like is the ability to run any sized injector, switch to a speed/density (MAP) based calibration to bypass any air flow meter problems from forced induction and big cams, and use a VTEC window. There also are the usual table editing and parameters such are cam angle, ignition, fuel, closed loop etc.

The price is $695, including tuning/datalogging software, and the expected release date is in June. June this year, if you’re in doubt.

For more information see FlashPro

We will update the above page with answers to your questions as they come up.

Thank you for your patience – we’ve been looking forward to this moment for some time.

Answers to questions. Disclaimer: some features may change by the release, but we're trying to give the best answers we can at the moment to your questions.

- Are there base calibrations?
Yes, for all common part combinations, plus JR and CT superchargers.

- Do I need dyno tuning?
It is not necessary for common part combinations (intake, exhaust), but you still have the option of custom tuning if you wish to get a little more. Camshafts probably will need tuning to get the most of the them - it will depend on the camshaft manufacturer.

- Can I get rid of the AFM?
You can switch to a MAP based calibration (recommened for forced induction and/or cams). You need to still physically retain the AFM because it also contains the IAT sensor.

- CT supercharger Stage 1 owners may choose to upgrade directly to the FlashPro.
If you paid a deposit for a Stage II reflash, you will need to discuss upgrade options with whoever took your deposit as neither CT Engineering or Hondata take deposits.

- Will this work on R18s or automatics?
Initially the FlashPro is for the US/Canada Si and Euro/Asia CTR. ECU part numbers are listed on our website.

- Will this work on more than one vehicle?
The FlashPro is locked to one vehicle. It can be unlocked and transferred to another vehicle by returning the ECU to stock.

- Can I share the calibrations I make for my car?
Yes.

- Do I need the laptop in the vehicle to reflash the ECU?
No. The FlashPro can upload either with or without a laptop.

- Is there a VTEC window?
Yes. This means that VTEC will operate based on rpm and engine load. For example, the supercharger reflashes have a VTEC window from 3200 rpm - 6000 rpm. At full throttle, VTEC operates at 3200 rpm. At light throttle, VTEC operates at 6000 rpm, and for load between full and light the VTEC will shift between 3200 rpm and 6000 rpm. (Engine load (MAP) is actually used to determine the switch point, but I've use throttle to illustrate the example). You can see some of this in a screen shot http://www.hondata.com/images/flashp...n-ignition.gif
Note that a VTEC window is more than just a VTEC point which you can vary by rpm - it has load characteristics too.

- So does that mean 1 unit Hondata flashpro can only work with one ecu or car only? Which mean i can't buy one set flashpro and used it together with a few of my buddies civics?
On ECU and vehicle at a time. You can unlock the FlashPro by returning the ECU to stock, and then transfer to another vehicle.

- Does it have control over DBW?
Yes, but we don't change anything to do with DBW. The first reason is that there is no need to - the DBW control works fairly well as it is. The second reason is for legal liability.

- Any option of immobilizer control?
The immobilizer can not be disabled. We've implemented a number of features designed to protect the owner of the vehicle from theft, and one of these is not to allow the immobilizer to be disabled. This is going to be much less of an issue than previous products because the ECU does not need to be removed / swapped.

- 90 sec programming - does that mean it can't do real time tuning?
Correct. In any case, if you are tuning a vehicle, you need to wait longer than 90 seconds between dyno runs in order to maintain consistency between runs. If you think you could set the dyno up as constant rpm or load, and then tune each cell in each table, this type of tuning does not work because the engine temperature and therefore output changes fairly rapidly, prohibiting this type of tuning.

- If the ECU had been reflashed by another maker, can Flashpro still work?
Probably - we could tell you based off the ECU part & serial numbers plus the calibration ID. When you unlock the FlashPro it will only be reflashed back to a stock calibration.

-Will this support a 64-Bit windows vista?
Not at first. We need to make sure the USB driver is working 100% before handing over the money to Microsoft, because after that every change to the USB driver incurrs a substantial cost to re-certify.
Edit: We have tested with Windows Vista 32 & 64 bit, and Windows 7 RC1 32 & 64 bit - the drivers work. This is a little puzzling as the 64 bit drivers are signed by us, but not certified by WinQual, so we would not expect them to work on Vista 64 and Windows 7 64 bit.

- can it control nitrous?
Not at the moment. However, you can at least control the ignition timing to make nitrous safer.

- Preorders?
Hondata is not taking preorders, but some of our dealers are.

- Will dealers need a software license?
No. Every FlashPro will come with the full tuning software FlashProManager.

- Are there training materials?
Three training videos to the FlashPro page.

- I have X intake, Y header and fluffy things hanging from my mirror. How much power will I make with your system?
I can take 5 stock, same model Hondas and make 5 different power figures on one dyno.
I can take one Honda to 5 different dynos and get 5 different power figures.
There are a huge number of combinations of cam, intake, header and catback. Some parts work and others do not. This system will allow you to tune your airfuel ratio, ignition and cam angle to match your combination of parts and fuel type. We are providing the tuning ability. The power you make is up to your (intelligent) combination of parts and tuning.

- Does it fix the rev hang?
Yes. The rev hang is the result of the injectors continuing to provide fuel for a period of time after the throttle is closed. This time is reduced by the calibrations provided with the FlashPro and the revs drop much sooner after throttle liftoff.

- Can it eliminate the second o2 sensor?
Yes. The secondary oxygen sensor is used to monitor the catalytic converter efficiency and assist with closed loop operation. For off road racing use in which a catalytic converter is not desirable, the secondary oxygen sensor can be disabled using the FlashProManager software without any negative affect on the tuning or operation of the car.

- What about smog with a MAP calibration?
According to US and CA law the FlashPro is for off road use only. However, if you did smog you would find the readiness codes supported and complete.
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Hondata: Do you guys make any promises that Flashpro will bend the Space/Time continuum? :popcorn:
No we do not. If so, we would have gone back in time and released the FlashPro in 2005.
No we do not. If so, we would have gone back in time and released the FlashPro in 2005.
any word on the stage 2 flashes disabling the reverse lockout? i was hoping if and when a fix for this comes out instead of having 3 days of downtime again since i'm only 30 min from you guys. could i just drive down there and have my car flashed with the update? it would save both of us shipping charges and me not having my daily driver.

or at least could i park at churchs shop and have you guys take the ecu so i dont see any trade secrets lol. i'm really just trying to avoid shipping chargers on both ends and 3 days of downtime for my daily driver.
nothing? hondata didn't release there product just cuz cobb said they were working on something.

hondata is a quality company that doesn't release products until they are well tested and they work. if hondata did not feel this flashpro was ready until this year nothing would make them rush a product out.
Hondata: In previous post, you stated that 1/3 of Hondata own 06+ Civic Si. If you don't mind me asking.....
* How many of those Si are N/A ??
* What modifications are installed ??
* How much HP are they making ??
hondata, i already have your reflash and i'm wondering I have spoken to hytech about getting cams they told me that they offer a reflash to adjust the engine to their cam specs, my question is would i still need flashpro?
Care to shed any light on this Hondata?

Hondata, you previously stated that the reason for the lack of nitrous control was due to the fact that we are only using our base ecu for tuning and not the extra chip you added to kpro ecus. Do you forsee the nitrous control ever being an added feature or is it a definate fact that we will never have nitrous control?
While I can understand the analogy you're trying to make, I don't agree with it.

Hondata is already in the tuning business, that is, modifying "stock" things. Flash Pro is going to be a very nice product, one that changes a lot of the Honda community. The K motor is just starting its legacy now that the H and B series have been retired, so I can only imagine future generations of the K20 or related ECUs. I actually had an idea to start a small website dedicated to "Flash Pro Calibrations", sort of like those old sites dedicated to Playstation game saves using the DexDrive. Just some way for people to share their tunes, what mods they were running and people could comment on it, etc.

That being said, over time, there will be a lot of underground and hobbyist development for the hardware. Someone will take it apart, analyze it, develop their own software to interact with it, and such. I am sure Hondata expects some of this, it would almost be silly for them not to when they're already appealing and doing business with a community that "wants more" out of their cars.

The question becomes what will they (the hobbyists) do with that. Will they sell their own software that is "compatible with" Hondata's ECU adapter, possibly make their own hardware, or be able to control more parameters that Hondata (legally or not) doesn't. These are the real questions and I am anxious to see the results. If it did come to be that there was an alternative "better" (free?) program to use in tandem with the OBD2 flasher, you'd still have to pay $800 for the hardware at the very least, even if you didn't use the Flash Pro Manager... so Hondata doesn't really lose out either way. Even if another adapter was developed, Hondata would have already made bank on the initial interest boom and customers then, they'd just be losing out on some potential ones that find out about it months or years down the road.

I admit, as a hobbyist programmer, I will be messing around with it to see what it can do and possibly third-party programs that can be developed with it. Of course, I wouldn't expect Hondata to accept responsibility for it and that's the stance they will probably hold. "What you do with it that is out of spec for what we instruct is all on you." For this reason, I don't think Hondata would ever come out that aggressively against someone unless they were openly selling a simple crack for their program to people.

I always did wonder if it was possible to "brick" an ECU (or put it some kind of invalid state that was almost irreversible). That'd be funny.
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With the basemaps included on the ReflashPro, are they going to be the equivalent to lets say CT-Engineerings 3.15 flash or is it just going to be a barebones turn key flash to get the car actually running?
With the basemaps included on the ReflashPro, are they going to be the equivalent to lets say CT-Engineerings 3.15 flash or is it just going to be a barebones turn key flash to get the car actually running?
They will have a few 'preloaded' maps to use including, but not limited to, CT-E Stage 1 & 2.
Is this the same reason why the throttle lag when pressing it at times?
Don't think so. I think this falls under the DBW that they can't touch do to legal reasons
Hondata can you comment about the tach being off a little...? I mean, i've never experienced the tach being off by 200-300rpms. When im bouncing off the fuel cut off @ 8,250 (right?) the tach is showing 8.2.

Damn internet speculation.
It depends on the car. I've seen some that look like they were off by about 300 rpms after 8000 rpms. My car was not. Stock, the rev-limiter would kick in around 82-8300 (hard to tell, since there are no hash marks past 8K). Reflashed, the limiter would kick in around 86-8700 rpms.

If you're stock and your tach points to 8.2K when at the rev-limit, then your tach is accurate.
Ok so check it out hondata... i am building my car to run it with nitrous and also tu run all motor... when i was running rotaryies some of the ecus had a memory so you can store 2 o 3 different tunes i.e. a street tune a track tune and maybe a tune for high boost per say. With my civic when i go to the track i plan to be running a 75 o 100 shot so the timing and cam degrees would be diferent if i wanted to get peak power for that then they would if i was running on the streets on just motor. Do you get what im saying here... is there somekind of memory in the unit where i can store both tunes or do i have to tune the car everytime to get peak power whether im gonna run on nitrous or all motor? I dont know if this has been asked already but there are like 50 something pages to this thread and am in iraq and dont have time to read all of them.. so if this is a repeat sorry but i would really appreciate and answer cause ima buy your unit as soon as it is released. Thank you once again.
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- Does it fix the rev hang? (added to first post)
Yes. The rev hang is the result of the injectors continuing to provide fuel for a period of time after the throttle is closed. This time is reduced by the calibrations provided with the FlashPro and the revs drop much sooner after throttle liftoff.



Stock injectors with the CT Stage 1 kit will not provide enough fuel with the stock fuel pressure.

As the FlashPro allows you to tune for larger injectors there is less of a need to crush the regulator for moderate power increases (lets say under 300 HP). However as you have (hopefully) seen on the video the fuel pressure drops as fuel requirements increase on the stock returnless system. If you are running power levels in the order of 300+ you must measure your fuel pressure and datalog your injector duty cycle.

Increasing your fuel pressure is useful up to a point (say from 54-64 psi) but do not assume that more fuel pressure = more fuel. The opposite can be true. Read our tech article on testing a 2000 Civic Si fuel pump.

Tech - Fuel Delivery

We have seen some fuel pressure regulators crushed to 90 psi. We would not recommend this.

If I was purchasing a CT Stage 2 kit with injectors and 3.3 pulley I would probably not bother crushing the regulator. However if I was running a 3.15 pulley with a race header I would examine the duty cycle while tuning. If it exceeded 90% I would consider bumping the fuel pressure by crushing the regulator or installing a return line system.
will a upgraded fuel pump help this issue a bit??????????
It depends on the car. I've seen some that look like they were off by about 300 rpms after 8000 rpms. My car was not. Stock, the rev-limiter would kick in around 82-8300 (hard to tell, since there are no hash marks past 8K). Reflashed, the limiter would kick in around 86-8700 rpms.

If you're stock and your tach points to 8.2K when at the rev-limit, then your tach is accurate.
Stock ECU until FlashPro comes out. Thanks for the info, i knew some were off but mine is accurate. :dancing:
- Rev hang & nitrous.
Refer to the first post.

- Hondata Civic Si(s) details.
I'll answer a broader question. The engine makes power, not the ECU. How much power a particular vehicle can make is not dependent on the ECU, but on the parts combination used and engine build. How much power the vehicle actually makes is dependent on the above factors plus the ECU tune. Thus what our cars are and how much power they make is more an indication of the parts combination that the ECU tuning.

- Hytech reflash.
There is no specific reflash for Hytech.

- vtecmike1
Email us. [email protected]

- Fuel pressure & flow
Increasing the fuel pressure will ultimately limit the power potential of the fuel system. See previous posts. Below low 300 hp range stock fuel pressure is ok with 650 cc injectors - with 520cc injectors you'll need to increase the fuel pressure. Above 400 hp you'll need a return fuel system. If you are between these values then keep an eye of the injector duty cycle and AF ratio - which you should be doing anyhow.

Final note: For some reason we see a lot of cars with exhaust systems which are highly restrictive, more so than stock. The flow of your whole exhaust system is determined by the most restrictive section. It does not matter how big the main pipe is, if you have a single 40mm restriction in the rear muffler you may as well have 40mm pipe all the way through. Inspect your exhaust system and looks for necked down sections of pipe and restrictions in the rear muffler.
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Final note: For some reason we see a lot of cars with exhaust systems which are highly restrictive, more so than stock. The flow of your whole exhaust system is determined by the most restrictive section. It does not matter how big the main pipe is, if you have a single 40mm restriction in the rear muffler you may as well have 40mm pipe all the way through. Inspect your exhaust system and looks for necked down sections of pipe and restrictions in the rear muffler.
great advice!
- Rev hang & nitrous.
Refer to the first post.

- Hondata Civic Si(s) details.
I'll answer a broader question. The engine makes power, not the ECU. How much power a particular vehicle can make is not dependent on the ECU, but on the parts combination used and engine build. How much power the vehicle actually makes is dependent on the above factors plus the ECU tune. Thus what our cars are and how much power they make is more an indication of the parts combination that the ECU tuning.

- Hytech reflash.
There is no specific reflash for Hytech.

- vtecmike1
Email us. [email protected]

- Fuel pressure & flow
Increasing the fuel pressure will ultimately limit the power potential of the fuel system. See previous posts. Below low 300 hp range stock fuel pressure is ok with 650 cc injectors - with 520cc injectors you'll need to increase the fuel pressure. Above 400 hp you'll need a return fuel system. If you are between these values then keep an eye of the injector duty cycle and AF ratio - which you should be doing anyhow.

Final note: For some reason we see a lot of cars with exhaust systems which are highly restrictive, more so than stock. The flow of your whole exhaust system is determined by the most restrictive section. It does not matter how big the main pipe is, if you have a single 40mm restriction in the rear muffler you may as well have 40mm pipe all the way through. Inspect your exhaust system and looks for necked down sections of pipe and restrictions in the rear muffler.
So will it be better to add a higher flow fuel pump with the 650cc injectors or don't even waste the time and moeny?
Hondata I already read the first post and I know that there isnt any nitrous control.. my question really isnt about nitrous its more about does your unit have a memory or will there be some kind of feature on the laptop program itself to saved a tune so that i can switch back and forth from when i am planning on running nitrous and when i am planning to run on motor.. That is my question. Thank you
I have searched but to no avail,what are the dimensions if you will for the fuel and spark timing maps?12X12,14X20?...I'm assuming it's the same as stock but I can't find that info either.
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