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1,682 Posts
worst idea EVER! because it ends up in a criminal conviction if you dont pay.
getting pulled over questions.
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255 Posts
I can't vouch for this, but a guy I know has done this and it worked for him in Port Alberni recently, this is what he sent to me:
Well, there is a better method of dealing with traffic tickets, or parking tickets for that matter. Refuse to play ball in their system, and use yours instead.
Traffic tickets issued are governed under the Equities Act. For all intents and purposes it is a "Bill of Exchange". I want you to remember that phrase, you are going to use it when the officer asks you to sign the ticket, which you are permitted to refuse. Look them squarely in the eye and say, "Officer, I recognize that as a Bill of Exchange. I will require the original, in order to properly pay it". While you're at it, do yourself a favor, keep a notepad and pen in your vehicle. You want to make notes of your encounter.
If you feel like showing the officer you are not afraid of him, you can go a step further. Any officer who interacts with you and asks you to provide him with identification and/or insurance and registration forms is legally required to provide you with three things, upon demand by you. "Officer, I'm going to need a copy of your business card, your photo id, and your badge." ** Now, trust me, he will not like that you have asked for it - but he is obliged to provide it to you. Just remember, this guy is packing heat - if he refuses to provide any of it to you - make complete precise notes with the date and time and don't go out of your way to piss him off. If you have a cell phone, or some other audio or video/audio recording device, you should already have turned it on before he even got to your window. It can come in handy down the road.
But at the very least, tell the officer you recognize the ticket as a Bill of Exchange and that you can only pay an original document. A copy will not be good enough for you. Of course, he cannot provide you with an original - this is their trick of putting you into dishonor immediately upon receiving the ticket and playing the game their way.
What you want to do within THREE business days, is to take that copy to a Notary Public and ask them to stamp it "DISPUTED - IMPROPERLY SERVED". You are not going to pay a bill that is not an original. In my business and personal dealings with any organization or individual, I must receive an ORIGINAL invoice - or I will not pay it.
Do not, under any circumstances, play the game their way. They would like you to follow the instructions imprinted on the reverse of the ticket. Do not do this. Ignore those instructions. Yes, they tell you on the reverse of the ticket what you should do if you want to dispute the ticket. If you follow those instructions, you haven fallen into the trap and are playing the game the way they want you to. Don't do it.
You may not believe this will work, but it will. Notary Publics are prohibited from advertising their services. This is one example why that is.
A notary public can do many things that lawyers do. In many cases, they have even more power. Did you know that a Notary Public can even issue default judgments? Have a problem with someone not paying their bill? Don't go to a lawyer. Go see a Notary Public.
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(I wonder how much a Notary Public would charge to do this...)
Well, there is a better method of dealing with traffic tickets, or parking tickets for that matter. Refuse to play ball in their system, and use yours instead.
Traffic tickets issued are governed under the Equities Act. For all intents and purposes it is a "Bill of Exchange". I want you to remember that phrase, you are going to use it when the officer asks you to sign the ticket, which you are permitted to refuse. Look them squarely in the eye and say, "Officer, I recognize that as a Bill of Exchange. I will require the original, in order to properly pay it". While you're at it, do yourself a favor, keep a notepad and pen in your vehicle. You want to make notes of your encounter.
If you feel like showing the officer you are not afraid of him, you can go a step further. Any officer who interacts with you and asks you to provide him with identification and/or insurance and registration forms is legally required to provide you with three things, upon demand by you. "Officer, I'm going to need a copy of your business card, your photo id, and your badge." ** Now, trust me, he will not like that you have asked for it - but he is obliged to provide it to you. Just remember, this guy is packing heat - if he refuses to provide any of it to you - make complete precise notes with the date and time and don't go out of your way to piss him off. If you have a cell phone, or some other audio or video/audio recording device, you should already have turned it on before he even got to your window. It can come in handy down the road.
But at the very least, tell the officer you recognize the ticket as a Bill of Exchange and that you can only pay an original document. A copy will not be good enough for you. Of course, he cannot provide you with an original - this is their trick of putting you into dishonor immediately upon receiving the ticket and playing the game their way.
What you want to do within THREE business days, is to take that copy to a Notary Public and ask them to stamp it "DISPUTED - IMPROPERLY SERVED". You are not going to pay a bill that is not an original. In my business and personal dealings with any organization or individual, I must receive an ORIGINAL invoice - or I will not pay it.
Do not, under any circumstances, play the game their way. They would like you to follow the instructions imprinted on the reverse of the ticket. Do not do this. Ignore those instructions. Yes, they tell you on the reverse of the ticket what you should do if you want to dispute the ticket. If you follow those instructions, you haven fallen into the trap and are playing the game the way they want you to. Don't do it.
You may not believe this will work, but it will. Notary Publics are prohibited from advertising their services. This is one example why that is.
A notary public can do many things that lawyers do. In many cases, they have even more power. Did you know that a Notary Public can even issue default judgments? Have a problem with someone not paying their bill? Don't go to a lawyer. Go see a Notary Public.
--------------
(I wonder how much a Notary Public would charge to do this...)
Joined
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5,078 Posts
Kinda been there, driving my old 96 ford explorer.
came to a complete stop on my street ( my house is 2nd from the corner) because a car was coming so I cant turn left until he turns. Turned out o be an undercover crown vic. After he turned past me I take my turn and go. 2 streets later and 3/4 of a mile later hes on my tail. 2 more streets and maybe a mile later (total of about 2 miles in residential area, lots of side streets to pull me over, he finally pulls me over.
Tells me I didnt make a complete stop on my street( I had to stop because he was coming), I give him what he needs and he goes to his car.??? Comes back w/ flashlight looking in back of truck and asks "where you going? I told him i was going to home depot (my dad gave me a list of thing to pick up). him: No youre not!. Me: yes I am look at this list. Him: ok, Here you go.
He gives me back my things and just leaves???? At least I didnt get a ticket
came to a complete stop on my street ( my house is 2nd from the corner) because a car was coming so I cant turn left until he turns. Turned out o be an undercover crown vic. After he turned past me I take my turn and go. 2 streets later and 3/4 of a mile later hes on my tail. 2 more streets and maybe a mile later (total of about 2 miles in residential area, lots of side streets to pull me over, he finally pulls me over.
Tells me I didnt make a complete stop on my street( I had to stop because he was coming), I give him what he needs and he goes to his car.??? Comes back w/ flashlight looking in back of truck and asks "where you going? I told him i was going to home depot (my dad gave me a list of thing to pick up). him: No youre not!. Me: yes I am look at this list. Him: ok, Here you go.
He gives me back my things and just leaves???? At least I didnt get a ticket
I just got stopped about 4 days ago in Ladysmith. For having too many people in my car, not having an "N" on the back, and having an open bottle of alcohol, which wasnt even mine and was being consumed by a girl in the back seat. He breathalized me and I got 000.
Anyways, the cop was pretty chill, but instead of giving me a much larger ticket and getting points he gave me just for having no "N". $110 ticket for not having my N, which wasnt my fault, it was stolen. I still dont wanna pay that because thats a f'in large fine for what it was... considering my dad got a $140 ticket for going 120 km/h in a 90km zone.
So what im wondering is should I dispute it? And if so, can you give some pointers?
Kevin
Anyways, the cop was pretty chill, but instead of giving me a much larger ticket and getting points he gave me just for having no "N". $110 ticket for not having my N, which wasnt my fault, it was stolen. I still dont wanna pay that because thats a f'in large fine for what it was... considering my dad got a $140 ticket for going 120 km/h in a 90km zone.
So what im wondering is should I dispute it? And if so, can you give some pointers?
Kevin
ROTFL!!! Dude this is one time where you don't want to dispute the ticket!
"Open liquor in a motor vehicle must not be readily accessible to anyone in the motor vehicle Passengers are not permitted to consume alcohol in a moving vehicle."
What are you going to say in front of the judge? Here is a sample conversation:
Yes sir, I am a new driver.
Yes sir, I know new drivers do have a lot of restrictions on what they can do.
Yes sir, as a new driver I had too many people in my car.
Yes sir, I know that having too many people in my car is a infraction of the rules as a new driver.
Yes sir, as a new driver I did have open alcohol in my car.
Yes sir, allowing people to drink in my moving car is against the law.
Yes sir I will accept you fining me for the the open alcohol and for having too many people.
Yes sir, I understand I will go back to the beginning of the Novice Phase and have the "N" on my vehicle for another 24 months minimum.
Yes sir, I understand now that the cop was trying to be reasonable to me and I took advantage of it because I'm a stupid idiot who had open alcohol in my car and too many people in my car.
"Open liquor in a motor vehicle must not be readily accessible to anyone in the motor vehicle Passengers are not permitted to consume alcohol in a moving vehicle."
What are you going to say in front of the judge? Here is a sample conversation:
Yes sir, I am a new driver.
Yes sir, I know new drivers do have a lot of restrictions on what they can do.
Yes sir, as a new driver I had too many people in my car.
Yes sir, I know that having too many people in my car is a infraction of the rules as a new driver.
Yes sir, as a new driver I did have open alcohol in my car.
Yes sir, allowing people to drink in my moving car is against the law.
Yes sir I will accept you fining me for the the open alcohol and for having too many people.
Yes sir, I understand I will go back to the beginning of the Novice Phase and have the "N" on my vehicle for another 24 months minimum.
Yes sir, I understand now that the cop was trying to be reasonable to me and I took advantage of it because I'm a stupid idiot who had open alcohol in my car and too many people in my car.
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230 Posts
1. Just because you didn't sign it doesn't mean ****..
2. Of course you can dispute it.. If you have a clean record, you can simply say you were doing nothing wrong and you took off your seat belt to get your insurance papers. Tell them your car makes a noise when your seat belt is off and it is almost impossible to drive with that noise on.
Cylias: Dispute it.. Why not? The cop can't use any of those things against you because
1) he probably wont even remember it (It take a year to get a court date)
2) He didn't fine you for it, so he can't use that as any basis as to why you deserve a ticket for having no N.. But simply saying it was stolen will most likely NOT work..
However, you could say you are a student who works blah blah and most likely you should plead guilty and ask for a reduced fine (Which will probably work 90% of the time)
By disputing, you have NOTHING to lose.. The cop may not even show up so you can get off free just for showing up to court..
at the very worst, you will simply pay your fine.
2. Of course you can dispute it.. If you have a clean record, you can simply say you were doing nothing wrong and you took off your seat belt to get your insurance papers. Tell them your car makes a noise when your seat belt is off and it is almost impossible to drive with that noise on.
Cylias: Dispute it.. Why not? The cop can't use any of those things against you because
1) he probably wont even remember it (It take a year to get a court date)
2) He didn't fine you for it, so he can't use that as any basis as to why you deserve a ticket for having no N.. But simply saying it was stolen will most likely NOT work..
However, you could say you are a student who works blah blah and most likely you should plead guilty and ask for a reduced fine (Which will probably work 90% of the time)
By disputing, you have NOTHING to lose.. The cop may not even show up so you can get off free just for showing up to court..
at the very worst, you will simply pay your fine.
I would be very careful in bringing this up. Cops write down notes in their notebooks/log books about each incident. They don't have to remember because they write it down. I would bet $1000 that he wrote down you had open alcohol and too many people.
The danger is the cop shows up and when you dispute it the cop gives his version of the story. Then you may have a judge asking you point by point if each part of the cop's story is true. If the judge is in a bad mood now you're fcuked! There is nothing stopping a judge from nailing your ass to the wall because you just admitted to a crime in front of a judge. Oh ya lying to a judge is even worse. They judge may fine you $110x3 = $330 ($110 for each violation).
Sure, you may be able to overturn the judges decision if you appeal, but if you don't want to spend $110 you're not gonna want to spend thousands on a lawyer for an appeal.
Dude you screwed up -- now it's time to pay the price. If you want to risk getting your entire story aired in front of a judge who may not take too kindly on you wasting the court's time go ahead. Just don't complain if things go bad.
The danger is the cop shows up and when you dispute it the cop gives his version of the story. Then you may have a judge asking you point by point if each part of the cop's story is true. If the judge is in a bad mood now you're fcuked! There is nothing stopping a judge from nailing your ass to the wall because you just admitted to a crime in front of a judge. Oh ya lying to a judge is even worse. They judge may fine you $110x3 = $330 ($110 for each violation).
Sure, you may be able to overturn the judges decision if you appeal, but if you don't want to spend $110 you're not gonna want to spend thousands on a lawyer for an appeal.
Dude you screwed up -- now it's time to pay the price. If you want to risk getting your entire story aired in front of a judge who may not take too kindly on you wasting the court's time go ahead. Just don't complain if things go bad.
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129 Posts
I am kind of disagree with you on this one, no offense, just want to clarify
Cop issued a ticket to me last year for making left turn on yellow light.
WTF... I've already past and stop the white lines and waiting for these 2 damn cars that run thought the yellow light from the opposite direction.
do you want me to charge and turn anyway to create an accident???
This damn cop should be chasing after those 2 cars instead of me.
anyway, of course I stand up and dispute.
I went to the court house and this damn cop was there too.
before we go into the court, he came to me and ask me why and what case I am suppose to be in for.
I said, none of your business, I don't need to tell you, then he quickly reference his little notebook and try to search for information.
At the end, he told the judge that he does not have any references to the ticket.... and I won the case.
I didn't have to explain to the judge at all.
Some cop keeps a log but some are damn messy and they don't know what the hell they are doing.
but for this case with alcohol, they might just have it down for future references.
thanks for reading.
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2,075 Posts
cops in vancouver r sneaky mother*******. I was driving home from the border one day and we are a at a red light and a brand new black ford fusion HYBRID pulls up beside me. I think nothing of it except that it looks good in black and when they are clean lol. So we are sitting at this light for what seems to be forever when a silver si 07-08 "drifts" around the corner trying to catch a yellow left turn signal before it changes. All of a sudden this black HYBRID fusion lights up like a bloody christmas tree and pulls the guy over. I dont know what i did to deserve this blessing because while at the light i wanted to show my buddy how fun it was to vtec as there was a long striaght away after the intersection......thank god he had another si to pull over first lol
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1,103 Posts
good info chan,sneeky lil piggy trying to get his little day journal out to see if he has anything of your predicament.
i bet there was two rust buckets who sped off and your's was a brand new car so it messed up the cop's Ego of you making more money then him on his little payroll for all the crap he deals with playing super cop with the spiked hair and sun glasses
i bet there was two rust buckets who sped off and your's was a brand new car so it messed up the cop's Ego of you making more money then him on his little payroll for all the crap he deals with playing super cop with the spiked hair and sun glasses
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1,103 Posts
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1,615 Posts
My dad was RCMP, he retired a couple years ago, but he was in the $60-70k along with his pension and all that jazz. Him and my step mom have a Beamer and a Chrysler Intrepid....lol
That's a reason why the police love it when people dispute tickets.I am simply an uneducated grunt working in the oil industry and I make more than 70k a year after only my first year. I would have to say that police officers are underpayed for the **** they have to put up with and the risks they take.
This does happen but there are alot of times that the officer has taken perfect notes. You did the smart thing and went to court. In Canada all the court costs associated with a ticket are included in the price of the ticket so if you do not go to court you are basically wasting your money.
The key with going to court is taking your own notes if you think you have been wronged. Your job in court is to question the officers accounts of the events of the day/night of the ticket. Something as simple as the weather the day of the ticket could get you off, if it was raining the day it happened then you keep track in your notes and then before court get a copy of Enviroment Canada's report of the hourly weather for the day in question. If the officers notes say it was sunny and clear but the info says it was raining on that given day then who is to say that any of his info is right? I know of a guy who got off due to this exact situation. You are basically giving reasonable doubt that the officer can recall the events.
If there are two officers in the car and they get you on radar speeding, question the officer with which of the two was the person to read the radar gun and when each of the two officers were last trained to operate the gun and when the gun was last calibrated. Again,I know a guy that got off due to the fact he had a police cadet in the car with him and he could not be sure that the cadet did not read the gun out to him.
PS- In Canada you will never have to sign a ticket an officer gives you.
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