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Discussion Starter #1
i currently own a 07 si coupe and a 04 figi blue civic ex auto. i wanted to trade in my 04 on a 08 civic ex auto and the salesman said he would give me the 08 ex for invoice. not such a bad deal. but he needed to appraise the 04 now my 04 has only 16,000 miles on it and the body is in great shape. the only flaw on it is a light paint scratch from someone trying to park next to me and scraped their bumper on my door. it just happened today also. when the appraisal manger went over my car he said that the scratch is no prob and it can be buffed out easily because its not down to the metal and it wouldnt affect my trade value at all. when he was done he said he will get with the salesman and give a value. the salesman said that the scratch affected my trade value because it cant be buffed out so he said 10k topps. i said that i can make a claim and get the scratch fixed by my insurance and he said still 10k topps because it will have paintwork done to it. is he on crack. that makes no sense what so ever. well i was trying to get kbb trade of 12k but they said only 10k according to black book. absolutely nonsense. he wouldnt budge either. so i walked out. how can they offer black book on trade and try to sell on kbb values. i know i can sell it for atleast 14k outright and i see a lot of 04-05 ex coupes on their lot with 40k miles and are trying to get 17k. they are nuts. why would they not want to pay what the car is really worth. if im willing to buy a new car for what its worth than they should do the same. i think the appraisel manager said maybe between 11-12k and the salesman tried to dupe me with 10k so he can make more profit. he even told me that the gg ex that i want is in greensboro nc and that they would have to drive it to charlotte and will not transport it on a truck. yeah right like i would trust they would drive it like ms daisy. then i have all highway chips and a beaten engine and over 100-200 miles on it that will decrease the value and they would expect me to pay top dollar. then when the car arrives with chips and misc damage then it will need paintwork also. why would they expect me to take a hit on mine because of paintwork but they wont take a hit on theirs if it needed paintwork. whats wrong with these dealers. am i being unreasonable on my trade value or should i trade for that 10k.
 

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Ouch man. I have good and bad experience from Crown Honda.

I'm currently trying out Hendrick Honda and so far so good. I'll be doing some visiting with them Monday and hopefully they can stay in my good graces.

Try Honda of Concord and Hendrick and see which one you can get a better deal. If you prefer to stay at Crown but you got a better deal elsewhere, try to have Crown match it.

I find playing the price matching game between those three dealers effective since they are so close to one another.

Crown offer me 07 SI for 21,900. Went to Hendrick and they match an 08 SI for 21,900. Told Crown and they change their price to 21,000 OTD. Hendrick match it to 21,250 but we say no and started walking away and they change it again to 21,000 OTD for a 2008 SI.

But yea man, try the other dealerships and get the best deal possible. Good luck man. Post up the updates.
 

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kene79 said:
i know i can sell it for atleast 14k outright and i see a lot of 04-05 ex coupes on their lot with 40k miles and are trying to get 17k.
It's simple, just sell it yourself to a third-party. Why bother with the trade-in at all? We all know you can sell it for higher if you sold it privately.

kene79 said:
why would they not want to pay what the car is really worth.
Since when did car salesman want to give you a fair value on ANYTHING? They would charge you for sitting in front of their desk if they could.
 

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first off, I can't stand Crown Honda. That being said:

You have a trade in, therefore numbers don't matter. You're getting 10k for yours and invoice for the other or you're getting 12k for yours and the new one for 2k over invoice. The bottom line is all that matters, don't worry about the trade in. If they offered you 2k for yours but the new one for 10k would you really turn it down cause the trade was too low? Of course not.

You talk about paying what their new car is worth and you think they should also. Where are you getting that from? What are you basing the numbers on because I don't think I've ever seen anything that put a new Honda's value at invoice. As for your trade in, it's not worth KBB to a dealer. A dealer can go to an auction right now and buy your car for $10k all day long for as many as they can find. My dealership used to grab S2000s, CRVs, and Odysseys (this is when they were wait listed) at auctions all the time for $10k less than what their "value" was.

Next you talk about "paying top dollar" for the car and 100-200 miles being unacceptable. Sorry but 100-200 miles doesn't do anything to the price of a car. Also, *most* transporters treat the car well. They're typically retired guys that do it to keep busy and driving a stock Civic isn't really going to get their juices flowing.

Basically I'm saying to chill out. If you're not happy with them, go somewhere else. Keep in mind that a Dealership is a BUSINESS. They're trying to make money. They can't give you a car for invoice and pay so much for your trade in that they can't make money off it. You have an invoice price so go buy the car and sell yours on your own. Hell, take it to CarMax and see what they'll give you
 

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This is why I need to forget my password on here or something, it's threads like this that I can't ignore!

First off, you're getting the 08 for INVOICE. Do you realize what a low profit margin they have when they're letting a car go for invoice? Apparently not, I got mine for a few hundred OVER invoice and I was psyched about that.

Secondly, your car (according to you and KBB) is worth 12k, and they offered you 10k. Your car is obviously not in selling condition, so they're gonna have to work on it. Then the next guy who buys it is gonna haggle them down on the price further. It's a business, do you see where they have to make money somewhere? If the gave you 12k for it, what money would they make on it? Absolutely none!

And thirdly, what do you expect them to do if the car you want isn't at their dealership? C'mon man, you're buying an 18 thousand dollar car, they aren't gonna ship it to you via an airline. It's gonne be driven. And no offense again, but it's an EX. I really doubt they're gonna be 'tearing up the streets' in that thing. Sheesh.

Bottom line - They want to (and deserve to) make a profit somewhere. The salesman is probably making less than a few hundred dollars letting the car go to you for invoice, and then you come here and complain that you aren't getting top dollar for your car. I really don't see what the problem is here, but I'm sure I'm gonna get 1249033 replies saying what an ass I am and whatnot for disagreeing with the 'norm' on here.
 

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dave421 said:
first off, I can't stand Crown Honda. That being said:

You have a trade in, therefore numbers don't matter. You're getting 10k for yours and invoice for the other or you're getting 12k for yours and the new one for 2k over invoice. The bottom line is all that matters, don't worry about the trade in. If they offered you 2k for yours but the new one for 10k would you really turn it down cause the trade was too low? Of course not.

You talk about paying what their new car is worth and you think they should also. Where are you getting that from? What are you basing the numbers on because I don't think I've ever seen anything that put a new Honda's value at invoice. As for your trade in, it's not worth KBB to a dealer. A dealer can go to an auction right now and buy your car for $10k all day long for as many as they can find. My dealership used to grab S2000s, CRVs, and Odysseys (this is when they were wait listed) at auctions all the time for $10k less than what their "value" was.

Next you talk about "paying top dollar" for the car and 100-200 miles being unacceptable. Sorry but 100-200 miles doesn't do anything to the price of a car. Also, *most* transporters treat the car well. They're typically retired guys that do it to keep busy and driving a stock Civic isn't really going to get their juices flowing.

Basically I'm saying to chill out. If you're not happy with them, go somewhere else. Keep in mind that a Dealership is a BUSINESS. They're trying to make money. They can't give you a car for invoice and pay so much for your trade in that they can't make money off it. You have an invoice price so go buy the car and sell yours on your own. Hell, take it to CarMax and see what they'll give you
:yeahthat:

Trying to get the KBB price of a car from a dealership (let alone privately, I think) is like asking for a goose to lay golden eggs. The dealership and the salesman need to make cash as well. Privately, you'll get better pricing, but you've got to be high on something to think that someone will pay the full 12k on the car. KBB is just a guideline, not hard fact.
 

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This is why I need to forget my password on here or something, it's threads like this that I can't ignore!

First off, you're getting the 08 for INVOICE. Do you realize what a low profit margin they have when they're letting a car go for invoice? Apparently not, I got mine for a few hundred OVER invoice and I was psyched about that.

Secondly, your car (according to you and KBB) is worth 12k, and they offered you 10k. Your car is obviously not in selling condition, so they're gonna have to work on it. Then the next guy who buys it is gonna haggle them down on the price further. It's a business, do you see where they have to make money somewhere? If the gave you 12k for it, what money would they make on it? Absolutely none!

And thirdly, what do you expect them to do if the car you want isn't at their dealership? C'mon man, you're buying an 18 thousand dollar car, they aren't gonna ship it to you via an airline. It's gonne be driven. And no offense again, but it's an EX. I really doubt they're gonna be 'tearing up the streets' in that thing. Sheesh.

Bottom line - They want to (and deserve to) make a profit somewhere. The salesman is probably making less than a few hundred dollars letting the car go to you for invoice, and then you come here and complain that you aren't getting top dollar for your car. I really don't see what the problem is here, but I'm sure I'm gonna get 1249033 replies saying what an ass I am and whatnot for disagreeing with the 'norm' on here.
My friend, you understand the way the car business runs better than people on here double your age! I applaud you! :thumb: If only everyone else on here could understand what you are saying. If they all did, i would be willing to bet that there would be a lot less of these complaint threads talking about how much dealers suck and don't deserve to make some kind of profit.
 

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You have to look at it this way: "trading in" a car is a convenience...you pay for that convenience by not getting top dollar for your ride...If you don't want to pay (lose $$$) then sell privately...

As others have said: NO dealer is going to give you blue book, that is unless you pay a higher price for the new car from them...I also agree that you have to look at the bottom line. That's how I always see things when I buy a new car...Who cares how much the new car is or how little they are giving you for the trade in...look at the bottom line.

It works much better if you simply tell the dealer: "this is how much I am willing to pay for x car...You make it happen...I don't care how..."
 

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i just bought my 08 si from hendrick honda. they were 30 bucks cheaper per month then honda of concord. overall it was a good experience, just seemed like everyone there was kinda the typical fake bullshitter salesman. honda of concord has better people and service, but you pay a premium for it. if you go to hendrick honda, stay away from steve rucker, the sales manager- hes a ****. my salesman was cool, ask for charles macfarlane. tell him vince with the 08 si sent you
 

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ok.........crown does suck, try huntersville....second take your car to a body shop and get a est done for the damage and then the dealer should give you top dollar minuse the 200 buck to fix it...[[[[ of done this before]]]] good luck
 

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i got my civic from crown of charlotte. once i took it in to get the tires rotated and oil changed and they didnt rotate the tires but they decide to charge me for it. did they not think i would notice or something??
 

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Discussion Starter #13
actually i was not getting a good deal because i sold my 04 ex to car max for 12k and went back to crown honda and they would only give me the 08 ex for 19500 otd. it did not include a custom pinstripe wheel locks mud guards and monnroof visor. i went to honda of concord and got all that for 19450 otd. i did better at concord. they would sell my 04 ex for 16900 and only want to give me 10k. they are nuts. car max just sold my 04 ex for 16000. thats what i paid brand new back in 04 otd. it only had 16000 miles when i let it go this year. you tell me. did i get a better deal at concord. i think so. you really have to learn how to work the dealerships if you want a good deal. no matter what they make money and if not they make the volume quota.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
actually i sold it to car max for 12k. i went to honda of concord and bought an 08 ex for 19450 otd with no miles and a moonroof visor, mud guards, wheel locks, and a custom pinstripe hand painted with lifetime warranty. you just have to know how to haggle to get what you want.
 

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My friend, you understand the way the car business runs better than people on here double your age! I applaud you! :thumb: If only everyone else on here could understand what you are saying. If they all did, i would be willing to bet that there would be a lot less of these complaint threads talking about how much dealers suck and don't deserve to make some kind of profit.
Thank you :thumb: It's common sense really, there is nothing you really need to 'know'. Obviously the guy isn't gonna make much if he's selling it for invoice and giving a good price on a used car. I swear, some people think a dealership should just give them the damn car for 5k under invoice or else they're just a 'stealership'. You can walk away at any time, you have all the power.
 

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I bought our LX from Crown Honda in Greensboro. They were ok I guess.

I went to Lake Norman, Flow, & Concord too. They all pretty much offered the same thing & stuck to that "black book" of theirs pretty strictly. They also don't take into account low miles or any options on trades. In my case I was trading an 06 Expedition 4x4 w/16k miles. They all offered the same price & it was much less than edmunds, NADA, & kelly blue book trade-in values. Finally I asked to see the magic book & figured out that they take the trade-in's average price & that's it. I was getting offered T/I value for an XLT Expedition, but nothing extra for all its options beyond what comes standard on an XLT. This truck was pretty well loaded with leather, DVD, courtesy package, towing package, the works. Those plus only 16k miles made the other trade-in values much higher. So when i looked at their precious black book, I noticed it had additional amounts for all those options, but they weren't adding them in. They didn't care when I pointed it out & said that was it & the truck would have to sell at auction & extras like those don't bring more. Nobody wanted a 12mpg truck.

So I had to decide if I wanted to eat that huge loss or keep my big truck. I had calculated my "magic number" for OTD cost based on what I thought was a fair trade in price. But I didn't take into account that the Honda dealers' source for used car values was different than the sources i used.

I had to adjust my "magic number" based on that. So when i went into Crown in Greensboro, I told them I understood how they value trade-ins (& my opinion of how unfair I thought it was) & they had to meet $X OTD with my truck as trade. It worked, but was a real PIA. I ended up using Carmax's offer price to do my calculations which was in between NADA et. al. and what the local Honda dealers were offering, but closer to what I thought the truck should be worth.

I really didn't care what they offered for trade-in though - I was concerned with hitting and overall OTD price. How they made those #s work was up to them. We also wanted to trade an 05 Explorer XLT 4x4 & I was running into the same problems with the lowball (compared to online sources) Honda offers. I ended up selling that truck to Carmax outright & got MORE than KBB, NADA, & Edmunds said it should be worth. So if you're really hung up on needing $X for the deal to work, try out Carmax. At least you have another reference for what your vehicle is worth.
 

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Don't forget that when you trade-it, you pay tax on the difference which in your case is about $800. So if you trading in your car for $10,000, in reality you get $10,800 for it.
 

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Don't forget that when you trade-it, you pay tax on the difference which in your case is about $800. So if you trading in your car for $10,000, in reality you get $10,800 for it.
That math isn't correct. (sales price - trade-in value) x X% would be what you're talking about. So if X (your state's tax rate on new vehicles) was 5%, you'd save $50 in sales tax for every $1,000 of trade-in value.

In NC it's only 3% on new cars (because they tax us EVERY year on our cars). So he's only paying the 3% tax on the difference - this year. Next year (& every year after), he'll pay tax on the full value of the car regardless of trade in. But getting $2,000 more for your trade only comes out to an additional $60 in taxes saved in NC - hardly worth considering.

So if he was considering trading for $10,000 or selling outright for $12,000, he'd save $300 in taxes but would end up losing $1,700 overall.
 
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