What are the temps like where you live? Extreme cold will and does have an effect on how your car starts in the morning. Our Civics don't have the largest batteries to begin with.

 

I live in Florida. Average temperature is around 80F. I used to live up in Boston, and drove this thing through many winters and never experience this. This 1yr old battery is same CCA as stock and the temps here haven't been lower than 40F in the last two weeks. Its shown this behavior at different temperatures and different times of the day, like leaving work at 5pm with 72F weather. It's baffling.

 

You car has an alternator that charges the battery.

No need to use the battery charger.

Get your alternator tested.

 

Alternator was tested and measured 14.2V no load, and 13.93V under load.

Only used charger since car sat at dealer for a few days. When I checked battery after picking it up (because of odd behavior) it was at ~320CCA. After the charge, and since, it has measured 495CCA.

 

Your alternator charges the battery the moment you start the car.

You do not need to put a charger on your battery.

You accomplish absolutely nothing by hooking a charger to your battery.


Your car is fine.

 

Yeah, alternator seems to be fine. Which is weird, because this behavior of 3-4 seconds of cranks before ignition has lasted for the past week. This includes trips to and from work where it would have been charging the battery. I'll keep an eye on it. I'm just trying to avoid getting stuck somewhere cause it won't start.

I'll keep this updated.

 

Long cranks is not a battery or alternator issue.

You said it was cranking 'slower', now you say it is cranking longer'.

And 3-4 cranks is not a long crank, its completely normal.

 

It's not 3 or 4 cranks. it's 3-4 seconds of me holding the ignition at ON. I can hear it slowly turn over, as the dash lights pulse, then it eventually starts. As I can hear the engine turning over, the time it takes for it to turn over decreases and it will start, but its definitely not normal. I have dealt with dead batteries before and it's a similar behavior.

 

sometimes starters can require more current to engage the solenoid/plunger as they wear. Common issue on older starters as there begins to be corrosion, increase in gaps, etc. Sounds like a bad battery but could be a starter. Honestly though you won't know till it dies.

 

Very similar to this video, except my dash pulses slower at first and it takes another 2 seconds for it to start. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ehDWc-9Od8

 

Whats the battery voltage with the key off? What's the battery voltage while cranking?

It sounds like a bad battery or a poor connection.

 

Here is how it was today. Started close to normal. You can see battery voltage is fine and once it started alternator had it at a good level. This was with radio and AC on. On crank battery voltage dropped to 7.21v.

http://youtu.be/eGrqqvCcWME

 

Certainly looks like a dead battery.

A proper load test will confirm. Load testers do not tell you that it has X CCA available like the numbers you have quoted, they are run at 1/2 the rated CCA for 15 seconds and the battery must maintain about 9-9.6v depending on temp. When using the starter, a healthy battery should stay in the 10-11v range.

I'd say the guy at advance did not know what he was talking about, in the real world even healthy batteries almost never come close to their rated CCA output, and I don't know what he means by "the starter CCA was low" If the starter current draw was low, there would be no reason for the battery voltage to dive like it does when starting. A starter will draw more current if the engine is harder to turn, which would result in the battery voltage going low, but it does not sound like the starter is struggling in such a manner. Any increased resistance in the circuit like loose connections would reduce current draw, so battery voltage would stay higher.

 

I appreciate the insight you've provided.

Here is the info that I was given after that test at Advanced Auto Parts.

I plan on taking the car to the dealer to get a proper load test done. They owe me anyway since this whole thing started after a warranty paint job that I had to bring back in, to fix shoddy workmanship and a new dent.

 

Here is the info that I was given after that test at Advanced Auto Parts.

The starter test printout shows the starter drawing 0 amps, which is impossible and just confirms that they didn't test it properly, didn't even have a current clamp hooked up.

Try see if its your actual starter. Then from there check your spark plugs or distributor. I had the same problem with my 240sx years ago and the distributer was the problem

These cars don't have a distributor. And a distributor won't cause a slow crank.

 

Try see if its your actual starter. Then from there check your spark plugs or distributor. I had the same problem with my 240sx years ago and the distributer was the problem

 

Thanks Chris. I thought that was very odd to be at 0 amps. The person was quite careless and seemed to be trying to just do the test and send me on my way.

I was pretty sure this car didn't have a distributor. Thanks for the confirmation to rule that out.

The car started up just fine this morning. I'm gonna keep an eye on it and get the battery tested at Honda. Thanks again.

 

Cold cranking amps are tested at 0 degrees F. That printout shows they tested it at 82 F, so it's not valid to compare that to the rated output. Nearly 500A should be enough, but it's another point against the credibility of that test.

 

I'm guessing the test was done with a digital tester, which does not directly test how many amps it can supply, it provides an estimate based on some clever programming. They are simpler/quicker/less dangerous for an untrained person to use, but I find them much less reliable than a good load tester.

 

This is the type of odd behavior i'm talking about.

The car sat overnight, temperature was like 66F at 7:35am when I left. Here's what it did: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9H3fXTqMrvY

I arrived at 7:54am and car was parked outside. It was a partly cloudy day, high of like 76F. I left work at 4:46pm. Here's what it did upon leaving. The behavior I had become used to over the past two weeks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loZpcwwgvlQ

At this point, I really think that it's the battery. They ruined it somehow when it was at Honda. Seems like the battery can't keep the voltage up to start the car well.

 

At this point, I really think that it's the battery. They ruined it somehow when it was at Honda. Seems like the battery can't keep the voltage up to start the car well.

If they accidentally drained the battery, that could ruin it if it was already near the end of its life.

 

A poor connection could easily cause the intermittent difficult start/slow crank/dimming lights. Or even a starter problem. But a poor connection does not explain the battery voltage dropping so low while cranking. You say this is a 500cca battery, so to pass a load test it must produce 250 amps for 15 seconds without falling below 9.6v at room temp. The starter motor normally draws closer to 100 amps, and immediately your battery voltage is dropping to 8 and 7 volts.

Have the battery load tested before you worry about anything else. If it somehow passes, test the actual starter current draw.

And I seriously doubt the dealer did anything to ruin the battery. Having one go bad after a year isn't as uncommon as you think, especially if the battery sat on a shelf for a long time before you bought it.

 

Thanks again for the good information. It was just a very odd coincidence then that this started the day I picked it up from the dealer. I have had no issues with it since I got it. Unfortunately for me, the Advanced Auto Parts wouldn't replace the battery for me since they "tested" it and said its "fine". I don't want to have to buy a new battery.

 

I see... You bought the battery from them, and now they are "testing" it to see if they have to replace it under warranty. Maybe they have a special "test" for batteries that are still under warranty, if you know what I mean.

If you can get it to consistently have trouble starting, and if you can get it to fail someone else's load test, then you should be able to take those two pieces of evidence and ask them to replace the battery. Talk to a manager and insist that they do, and tell them that you don't think their test is accurate. Bring a report from somewhere else that shows it fails the load test, and show them the sluggish start.

Have you cleaned the battery terminals? Wire brush the terminals and connectors until they are nice and shiny, then make sure the connectors are tightened to spec. Corrosion could cause a bad connection.

 

Update:

So the car had trouble starting again this morning and when I left work. So I decided I didn't have time to deal with anymore nonsense and went back to the advanced auto parts store.

They looked up when I purchased the battery last year and it was April 18th. I talked with a guy there and he insisted that we needed to test it again with his nonsense tester. This time, the car actually struggled starting so that he was able to see it. He didn't think anything of it and at the end of the test insisted that the battery just needed a charge. So I decided to humor him and it charged for 30 mins.

So we put it back in the car and of course, it started up fine after sitting on a charger. Then he tested it again and the voltage had dropped as well as the CCA of the battery, but that wasn't good enough. So he kept testing it. He finally just decided to replace it and said he'd do it but the problem is my alternator or starter. It seemed he kept bouncing back and forth on what the problem was.

He tested it a few more times then said the alternator was bad because it only came on while the AC was on and the car was being revved. I told him that's nonsense because I tested it at idle and it was charging with the AC off. He said he could test it again and show me. This is when I broke and told the guy to stop wasting my time. So he goes to grab a replacement and then says they don't have any. So he gives me a paper and tells me to go to another AAP.

It was then that I worked out that they apparently can't replace batteries without having a "authentication" code that is printed on the piece of paper that comes out of the battery tester. So he had handed me a piece of paper that must have come from an older failed battery with a valid code.

So I headed to the other AAP and they replaced the battery. 2 hours of my evening, but I had a new battery, and it started up just fine. I'm never going to an
AAP again.

 

Don't worry, I got a 49/50 on my ASE electrical exam and have over $1000 worth of electrical test equipment in my tool box, doesn't stop parts store cashiers from arguing with me about defective parts.

 

Update:

The past two days, morning, afternoon, and morning again, the car started fine. First time around, I checked with multimeter, 12.51v after sitting all night, and on crank, only dipped to 11.24v (vs the 7.21v with old battery). I wanna thank everyone for their input in helping me solve this issue. Especially Chris (TheIncident88) for sharing his expertise in automotive electronics.

 

My car (06 FG2) is having the same symptoms with the slow cranking. I replaced the battery a little under a year ago. But the video that was posted when it was struggling to start is the same exact problem im having...i havent tested anything yet...but reading this definitely changed my outlook on my situation...just hoping that it is a going bad battery and not a starter or alternator.

 

Well hopefully it was just your battery, but don't totally look away from the starter. At least on the Si, the 8th gens are known to have starters that will start to crank slowly, especially when cold and even with good battery voltage. It really throws Honda guys off because the starters used through the 80s and 90s would never die and would start just like new 20 years and 250k later.

 

I had the same symptoms and it was my starter car the car sash would light up and everything and the car wouldn't turn over battery wasn't dead replaced my starter and it turned right over I have diy of how to replace it but don't have authority yet if you have questions lmk I can send you pics


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

 

Starting Problem, Slow Turnover

I know this is a very old post, but doing my internet searches for similar problem I arrived here..

I have a 2008 Civic 2dr. EX, with 125k miles, its been a great car until this year. I'd like ot keep it for another few years.

Recently it has stared a very similar problem, perhaps the same.. it randomly either urns over very slowly or not at all, then randomly turns over at a fairly normal rate.
I recenly drove it about 1 hour, sat for 1.5 hours, drove it about 1 hour, stopped and had lunch came out and it would try but not turn over.. went for a walk 15 minutes, it turns over barely but starts, drove hoe 10 minutes.
Let it sit and the next day it starts as normal. Few days later similar experience.
This has been happening for a few weeks now.

I got out the old multi-meter and stared checking connections, measuring voltages, battery reads about 12.6, start the car and it reads 14.4, and after about 15 minutes drops to 12.94.. seems like the alternator is doing what it should.

One day it would not turn over, called AAA who sold me the battery, the guy comes runs his test says battery is bad (8 monts old) and replaced it under warranty.. started the car he ran his test again said good to go.. shut it off and signed the papers. Just before he leaves I try to start it again, he is surprised it barely turns over.. I said are you sure that battery is fully charged and he said yes.. I tried it again and it turned over slowly but started.
The guy looked puzzled but like any good talking quick fix guy he said it must be your starter, sounds like its flooding, starters flood.. I laughed and said dude engines flood, starters but I never heard of a starter flooding unless the water was deep. But said OK thanks for the battery.

I took it by AutoZone for the free test, they have a digital tester, hooked it up and the guy says it shows your battery is fully charged but that it is bad.. he did not hook up the amp clamp...

I took it to a local mechanical auto shop, fairly well known independant shop that is AAA certified to do their batteries.. the guy drove the car into the garage bay, ran the similar test to AutoZone, measured voltage... and the car started ok for him a couple times and said how often and when did this happen.. I explained and he handed me the same printed readouts as the OP posted here.. he said it could be the Starter but would have to charge me to get that far into diagnose it cause he'd have tu put the car on the lift but he could do that if I left it with him. I elected to not leave it, got in and it started.

Yesterday I decided to try again myself after I tried and it barely turned over when I got in it to go somewhere.. got out the trusty volt meter and measured voltages on the wife's '08 Accord, battery 12.6, start it 14.4 for several minutes. Popped the hood on the Civic voltage 12.5 (on the post or the connected terminals) connected up the jumper cables, start the Accord 14.4 volts and let it run for about 20 minutes until it started dropping.. Started the Civic, it turns over very slowly but started, shut down the both, remove jumper cables measuerd the voltage 12.5, started te Civic voltage measured at 14.4, after 10 mnutes or so it drops to 13.2....

This morning it barely turns over but starts, go to the eye doc to pick something up, shut it down for only a couple minutes, turn the key and it tries but won't turn over, wait a couple minutes and it turns over very slowly but starts and drive home 10 minutes...

Started internet search again after thinking it was the battery and/or the alternator but don;t think that any more, and arrive here... it sure sounds and looks like ab bad battery or bad connection but I'm stuck.

 

I know this is a very old post, but doing my internet searches for similar problem I arrived here..

I have a 2008 Civic 2dr. EX, with 125k miles, its been a great car until this year. I'd like ot keep it for another few years.

Recently it has stared a very similar problem, perhaps the same.. it randomly either urns over very slowly or not at all, then randomly turns over at a fairly normal rate.
I recenly drove it about 1 hour, sat for 1.5 hours, drove it about 1 hour, stopped and had lunch came out and it would try but not turn over.. went for a walk 15 minutes, it turns over barely but starts, drove hoe 10 minutes.
Let it sit and the next day it starts as normal. Few days later similar experience.
This has been happening for a few weeks now.

I got out the old multi-meter and stared checking connections, measuring voltages, battery reads about 12.6, start the car and it reads 14.4, and after about 15 minutes drops to 12.94.. seems like the alternator is doing what it should.

One day it would not turn over, called AAA who sold me the battery, the guy comes runs his test says battery is bad (8 monts old) and replaced it under warranty.. started the car he ran his test again said good to go.. shut it off and signed the papers. Just before he leaves I try to start it again, he is surprised it barely turns over.. I said are you sure that battery is fully charged and he said yes.. I tried it again and it turned over slowly but started.
The guy looked puzzled but like any good talking quick fix guy he said it must be your starter, sounds like its flooding, starters flood.. I laughed and said dude engines flood, starters but I never heard of a starter flooding unless the water was deep. But said OK thanks for the battery.

I took it by AutoZone for the free test, they have a digital tester, hooked it up and the guy says it shows your battery is fully charged but that it is bad.. he did not hook up the amp clamp...

I took it to a local mechanical auto shop, fairly well known independant shop that is AAA certified to do their batteries.. the guy drove the car into the garage bay, ran the similar test to AutoZone, measured voltage... and the car started ok for him a couple times and said how often and when did this happen.. I explained and he handed me the same printed readouts as the OP posted here.. he said it could be the Starter but would have to charge me to get that far into diagnose it cause he'd have tu put the car on the lift but he could do that if I left it with him. I elected to not leave it, got in and it started.

Yesterday I decided to try again myself after I tried and it barely turned over when I got in it to go somewhere.. got out the trusty volt meter and measured voltages on the wife's '08 Accord, battery 12.6, start it 14.4 for several minutes. Popped the hood on the Civic voltage 12.5 (on the post or the connected terminals) connected up the jumper cables, start the Accord 14.4 volts and let it run for about 20 minutes until it started dropping.. Started the Civic, it turns over very slowly but started, shut down the both, remove jumper cables measuerd the voltage 12.5, started te Civic voltage measured at 14.4, after 10 mnutes or so it drops to 13.2....

This morning it barely turns over but starts, go to the eye doc to pick something up, shut it down for only a couple minutes, turn the key and it tries but won't turn over, wait a couple minutes and it turns over very slowly but starts and drive home 10 minutes...

Started internet search again after thinking it was the battery and/or the alternator but don;t think that any more, and arrive here... it sure sounds and looks like ab bad battery or bad connection but I'm stuck.

I run into this alot. Try this. The next time you notice it's cranking slow, stop. Get a boost from either a battery booster or another car. Does it crank faster? Replace the battery. If it is still the same then replace the starter. Before you replace the starter you may have a bad ground. Take your booster cable and connect the black to the battery negative and the other black to the engine itself, somewhere metal. If it cranks faster you have a bad ground. That's all it can be. Battery First, then ground wire, then starter.

 

Thx for the reply...
Yesterday did a bit more trouble shooting and I'm looking more at the problem being either the Starter or Starter-Solenoid.. but for sure it could be a bad connection althought I'd think it was at the Starter..

Tried jumping it from the wifes Accord, no difference.. let her car run for about 20 minutes with the cables attached, still same same.

Measured the voltage at the battery, 12.52.. slow turnover but no start then no more turnover same symptoms I've been experinecing.

Measured the voltage with my trusty digital multimeter, wish I had a clamp on/around amp meter, and tried turning it over the voltage drop is minimal down to 11.5ish... but can't measure current draw with my trusty multi-meter.
Disconnected the wires, cleaned the terminals and the battery post.. connected the neighbors battery charger and it jumps up to about 8amps, but within a minute drops to zero saying the battery is fully charged.

Popped open the rubber cover on the positive terminal, 2 wires crimped to the terminal bolted onto the connector... does not appear loose and voltage measures the same at the end of either wire where they stick out of the crimp.

Connected the terminals to the battery, again connected the battery charger and same thing with charger clamps connected to the wire terminals, drops to zero amps almost immediately. Tried the key and it turns over very slowly, then not.


Now it's not turnng the engine over at all, just hear the audible click (I think coming from the gage cluster).. but no turnover.

Tried it again today and it seems ot be soildly failed now, click but no turnover.

The engine usualy would at least start if I got a couple revolutions of the engine even when it was barely turning over. That easy start up was my saving grace.

Note the lights, ac-fan, radio, windows up/down seem to work OK when in this state.

Tried it again later in the day, its a 90+ day here, and still click but no turnover as if the solenoid is not passing any current to the starter motor.

Unless I can get it started I'm screwed and will be at the mercy of some mechanic I can get it towed to... I'm just to old and brittle to jack it up, remove the wheel and try to wrangle myself under the car to reach the starter.