Piece Meal Suspensions????????

[Highrev1]

OK so as many of you know I would always prefer to piece my suspension pieces together. Too many people consider a "pre-built" coilover as a complete suspension solution, thats fine, unless your building your car for MAX handling. Or truly want control over your cars handling traits.

You have to break down exactly what the suspension is.

DAMPERS-The most important piece.
SPRINGS-These adjust roll couple, and u want these as low rate as possible.
SWAY BARS-These will also adjust roll couple, and generally on a FWD car you want the front bar as soft as possible
ETC.

Why piece each part seperatly? I will use an example here. A Home stero if you want the best you get the best AMP, Speakers, Wires, ETC. Or you can get a mini system, and that would be fine for most but for people who truly are in the know get seperate components.

Same with suspensions. You want to be able to fine tune it for exactly what you will be using it for and the pavment your tires see. Lower spring rates if your roads are rougher than what I drive on. Harder if your using it for track applications. How you as a driver react to the car, how you drive your car are all things that can be taken into account when your piece your parts together.

These are ALL things that a "pre-built" coilover can't do. WHY?? Cause they are building that same setup for a guy who drives in Maine and a guy who drives in California. They are making somthing that fits most of the people most of the time. Nothing that excels at any ONE thing.

These are good for most on the forum...they do what their supposed to . BUT if you were truly in a race someone who piced their parts seperatly/properly would have the upper hand. Basically you CAN get a better suspension Piece Mealing it together.

[Jardiniboy]

More people prefer the pre-built suspensions because it's cheaper and they're not gonna drive their cars to the limit.

[Highrev1]

Even if not for the limit don't you want better stuff for your money?

It's not really cheaper though, For rough estimates. Figure around $500-600 for Dampers, and like $400 for height adjustable springs thats about $900-$1000 for a far superior product that can be custom tuned by YOU the user. What a "Pre-built" setup cost on average?

[Sirbelch]

I want stiffer rear springs. I paid 1600 for Flex's. They are 500 lbs in the front and 560 in the rear. I want some 600 for the rear or maybe even 650.

The major freeways in Cali SUCK. They have got to be the least maintained freeways on the planet. However, our twisty roads are pretty well maintained especially in Napa County. (wine makes a lot of money)

[Jardiniboy]

Originally Posted by Highrev1

Even if not for the limit don't you want better stuff for your money?

It's not really cheaper though, For rough estimates. Figure around $500-600 for Dampers, and like $400 for height adjustable springs thats about $900-$1000 for a far superior product that can be custom tuned by YOU the user. What a "Pre-built" setup cost on average?

Some pre-built coilovers average around 900-2000 for an SI. I know what you mean though, everyone has their own preference on how they want their car to handle. But some people don't even know what they're buying. They're just buying it because other people have it and say it's good.

[tomblaze679]

Originally Posted by Sirbelch

The major freeways in Cali SUCK. They have got to be the least maintained freeways on the planet. However, our twisty roads are pretty well maintained especially in Napa County. (wine makes a lot of money)

I live in Napa and drive on I-80 to and from work everyday.

[mbringle]

The biggest worry for me with piece meal is matching the damping rates of the shock to the spring rate so we are pretty close to critically damped. And I never see "suggested sping rate" values on shocks.

[Highrev1]

Originally Posted by mbringle

The biggest worry for me with piece meal is matching the damping rates of the shock to the spring rate so we are pretty close to critically damped. And I never see "suggested sping rate" values on shocks.

Well you should work with the tuner, do determine the best spring rates for your application. If your tuner can't help you with that then FIND a NEW ONE, that just means they sell parts and don't really have a clue IMO...and you will probably end up with some Tein's

Dampers don't have a suggested rate..They can have a max that they can control generally but they are usually inteded to work within a range of rates, this is also why the ACUTAL adjust in the damper is important.

[Forklift352]

Thanks,Highrev1
Im now piecing my stuff togeather. I got the Ingles front camber and skunks
rear on the way.I would like to lower soon but would like some help on springs
Im looken at neuspeed 1.5 drop.Only because price and 1.5 drop.When some
Koni's or the like avail them selfz.I will add them later.What do you say about
the neuspeeds? This will be a D/D car but I drive the back 40 alot (twistyz and sutch.)When I deside on springs (and can pay for them)Im droppen and
going with your sug. alinment .Thanx any help.

[Highrev1]

I am not a huge fan of the neuspeed spring, I would rather suggest Eibach Pro-kit if you are looking for a nice progressive rate spring...

[bulletSisedan]

What would you suggest for a stiff ride. I live in AZ and we have mostly upkept, smooth roads. I want a stiff ride because I dont need to worry to much about bumps and such but I would like to cruise comfortably with out to much jolt. I dont think Im going for a front sway bar but a rear for sure. Any input on Dampers and spings?

[Highrev1]

Stiffer is NOT what you want to handle the best. Read the suspension sticky...
Stiffer valving in a damper means weight transfers faseter. That same weight transfer means there is less traction. So Adjusting the roll couple distribution, meaning which end transfers weight faster is what is key to handling.

Its also going to highly depend on the tires you are running....As a More aggressive tire will like a "stiffer" suspension than one that has less grip.

[Forklift352]

Thanx, Highrev1
The place Im thinken of getting my wheels will give a free set of springs.
The name of the springs ZENN.Cheking around zenn gots good + bad rep.
Is progresive springs prefered?

[Highrev1]

Originally Posted by Forklift352

Thanx, Highrev1
The place Im thinken of getting my wheels will give a free set of springs.
The name of the springs ZENN.Cheking around zenn gots good + bad rep.
Is progresive springs prefered?

FREE springs probably=cheap Dump em

Progressive or linear depending on what the car will be used for and the level of the driver and tires you are running and well you get the idea :)

[Sirbelch]

liner springs are more perdictable than progressive rate springs.

[bulletSisedan]

I understand, what do you suggest for better but still aggresive handling Im no auto-xer yet but I love the twisties of N. AZ.

[Sirbelch]

Even if you don't auto x, you could still have a kick ass suspension for the twisties. HFP would be a good up grade and cheep to boot. You could also get some aftermarket dampers and GC springs.

[r18power]

Good thread, Greg. rep 4 u

[Forklift352]

The GC springs what would I be looking for? Iv got good tires soon ill have better,and camber kits (do I need 2 sets for the front?)
now just doin the spring thing.As soon as the market bares some good damper.What would be the claim to fame on the GC?
Im a good driver now and I ll be more better latter. I would like to"grow" in to my suspention not change springs in a yr. or 2.

[xevo8]

Greg,
How can I get some more info on the Koni setup ($1800)
Currently have the BC+N have for a month and thinking of selling them. I think that I need a more aggressive setup.
Track my car a lot. what you recommend?