Stiffness of swaybars

[jwlee7]

Scenario:

You have coilovers, 9k front 11k back springs, the car is oversteer happy.

You want to slap on some swaybars, while keeping the oversteer tendency as is essentially (or not make it worse) while reducing the sway of high speed turns.

Do you:

A) rear bar only
B) rear + front same company
C) rear + front mix n match (different stiffness rates)
D) front only


Why? How stiff would you go?

[civicferio]

From a performance stand point you want to upgrade the rear bar before the front. But since your car is already oversteer happy, I assume turn-in oversteer. I suggest you check your rear alignment settings or corner weights first before going any further. A twitchy car at the limit is hard to drive fast. Good Luck!

[ebdiam]

Stiffen the rear and make the front more loose.

[beast14]

in for suggestions

[gotsnodooks]

Originally Posted by ebdiam

Stiffen the rear and make the front more loose.

[TeamBadger]

You can probably address such an issue with an alignment change

[VanSi07]

Originally Posted by ebdiam

Stiffen the rear and make the front more loose.

This is going to make the car oversteer even more... why would you do that?
He says he likes the balance as-is, so that's not helping.

You should do a matched pair of bars, keeping the front-rear balance about the same.
Keep in mind as your spring rates are higher than stock, swaybars are going to have less overall effect on balance than they would on a stock car.

[ebdiam]

It oversteers entering but its perfect when exiting. You definitely don't want a stiff front with fwd cars.

[jwlee7]

The goal is slightly oversteer, if I didnt have that option I'd opt for neutral steer instead of more oversteer, as I can use brake induced oversteer decent enough to give myself a better turn in angle.

The only reason why changing the alignment isnt in my interest at this point is because after a full session of hard driving, the temperatures of my tires are even all around the tire (even contact patch)

But then again.. Im just hypothesizing that this problem is due to the sway. It might be aero-related, as the problems dealing with turns + hills at high speeds. Someone suggested that a big wing would be able to hold down the chassis so I would get more grip (and not oversteer even more)


p.s. i think i only have like 3 choices for swaybars.. and they have a big difference in thickness so ill just call it soft med and super big

[OttoX]

Originally Posted by jwlee7

The goal is slightly oversteer, if I didnt have that option I'd opt for neutral steer instead of more oversteer, as I can use brake induced oversteer decent enough to give myself a better turn in angle.

The only reason why changing the alignment isnt in my interest at this point is because after a full session of hard driving, the temperatures of my tires are even all around the tire (even contact patch)

But then again.. Im just hypothesizing that this problem is due to the sway. It might be aero-related, as the problems dealing with turns + hills at high speeds. Someone suggested that a big wing would be able to hold down the chassis so I would get more grip (and not oversteer even more)


p.s. i think i only have like 3 choices for swaybars.. and they have a big difference in thickness so ill just call it soft med and super big

hrmmmm I was gonna say why dont you try to increase the negative camber in the rear slightly and see if that helps .

[ray]

The basic idea is you stiffen the front and the rear bar in equal degree is you wish to maintain the current front/rear balance.

As far as whether you use the same company's front and rear bars, that would depend on to what degree they do that. In most cases one might expect that they would stiffen in approximately equal degree, but being a member of any one manufacturer's kit does not dictate the stiffeness of any one bar or bars. If you have any question of the affect of any particular kit on the balance of the car you need to make specific inquiries of the makers and/or users of that kit to ascertain its exact properties.

I find that increasing swaybar stiffness increases the effective stiffness of the car's springing in addition to reducing body roll and lateral motion of the car on the suspension. I can't help but think that with springs as stiff as what you are running you might well wish to stop short of the stiffest bars possible if this is a primarily a street car.

[trickyazn]

I would just get new tires. Oversteer happy is driver reflection. The car rotates well right? Learn to control it through turns.

[jwlee7]

Originally Posted by ray

The basic idea is you stiffen the front and the rear bar in equal degree is you wish to maintain the current front/rear balance.

As far as whether you use the same company's front and rear bars, that would depend on to what degree they do that. In most cases one might expect that they would stiffen in approximately equal degree, but being a member of any one manufacturer's kit does not dictate the stiffeness of any one bar or bars. If you have any question of the affect of any particular kit on the balance of the car you need to make specific inquiries of the makers and/or users of that kit to ascertain its exact properties.

I find that increasing swaybar stiffness increases the effective stiffness of the car's springing in addition to reducing body roll and lateral motion of the car on the suspension. I can't help but think that with springs as stiff as what you are running you might well wish to stop short of the stiffest bars possible if this is a primarily a street car.

handling ability is most important for me. .so i will probably get hotchikis(sp) then. they r the biggest at 28mm

[FABMotorsports]

don't opt for the biggest, you want something that will be well balanced with your car.

[paolo2k2]

i suggest mixing and matching until the desired handling characteristics YOU want are acheived...first start with a bigger rear sway and compensate with a larger front sway which will offset the stock R.C.D...trying different ratios is the only way you'll find out what setup will work for you...

[FABMotorsports]

also, don't be confused by the diameter of the bar. oftentimes anything above 25mm is going to be a hollow bar, not solid.

[trickyazn]

If you have $$, change the spring rates.

[FABMotorsports]

Originally Posted by trickyazn

If you have $$, change the spring rates.

not recommended unless the shocks are revalved.

[trickyazn]

False, depending on certain coilovers.. custom springrates will not have an adverse effect on handling.

Tein/Koni/Skunk2 all benefit from custom springrates on all their competition coilovers.

[FABMotorsports]

i'm sorry but if the OTS coilovers are not valved to withstand HIGHER spring rates, i guarantee you they will fail. Buddy Club for example, valves their Racing Spec Dampers to withstand 20K spring rates supposedly.