Brakes Spongy after bleed.

[nerdrum]

My buddy and I are completely flabbergasted by this, we've bled probably 200 cars between us and we've never had this issue before in any car. While the car is off the brake pedal is completely stiff and 100%. When the car is turned on, it gets spongy and there's about 2-3 inches of travel before they start to bite. The pads are brand new everything is new and we bled the system four separate times and we don't know what the issue is.

Any suggestion guys? Possibly have to bleed the abs system itself or?

[paolo2k2]

can u tell me ur entire routine starting from when u filled the master cylinder and started bleeding the line?

[Moose]

Did you follwo the Bleed sequence in the helms (different from other earlier honda's) FL, FR, RR, RL ?

Did you bed in the new pads ... I have found that the pedal will feel soft because pads are not biting yet,and as a result you use more pedal pressure than you would normally, thus the pedal feels lower for an equal amount of stopping force.

Moose

[jrotax101]

First flush of my system after changing to SS lines, i had the same thing happen.

I drove round with it - bedded the pads in, then bled them again 2 days later. Problem solved.

[Zeuceone]

Its rear right, rear left, front right, and front left. I think the abs is flushed when you bleed the lines.

[Moose]

Originally Posted by Zeuceone

Its rear right, rear left, front right, and front left. I think the abs is flushed when you bleed the lines.

Hmmmm - Where do you get this from - I got my sequence right from the Helms ( FL, FR, RR, RL ) ... I will have to scan it tonight and post it up

Moose

[jrotax101]

I've always done mine FL FR RR RL also and had no issues since ( unless i boiled the fluid ), but that's a different story.

[paolo2k2]

hey moose...can you please scan the rear suspension assembly...basically the torque figures for the nuts and bolts....the bolts for upper control arm and lca and trailing arm...i took off everything for a rear disc conversion and im wondering what the torque specs are

[Zeuceone]

I think I saw it on here somewhere. Don't you start from the side furthest from the MS?

[jrotax101]

on most cars, apparently not ours.

[Zeuceone]

Weird. Worked for me.

[nerdrum]

Okay, I think my problem might be that I've used the technique that's been the basic how-to in terms of brake bleeding for the last 30 years. I went rear right, rear left, front right, front left. I'm really confused, is this seriously not how you're suppose to do it?

[King Bob]

you are supposed to start as close to the master cylinder as possible and end as far from it as possible

[Moose]

There are two technologies that have changed the brake bleed sequence over the years ... ABS and EBD.

Prior to these YES you generally started furthest from the Master cylinder (RR), did the opposite linked corner (FL) Did the other rear (RL) and did the opposite front (FR)

This was done to bleed out the longest line first (RR), then as the brake sytems are cross-linked thru an isolated dual output Master cylinder to two prop valves that split the pressure front to rear for each isolated circuit you would do the front right, then the back left and the cross-linked Front right


BUT when ABS came along both isolated lines from the M/S go thru a ABS pump / solenoid / splitter. This some what equalised the line lengths and changed the bleed sequence depending on how the ABS module was configured.

Now with EBD (electronic Brake distribution) the fixed % prop valves are gone, and replaced by 4 electronic valves that work with ABS system to distribute the fluid pressure.

This has changed how fluid flows thru the system ...THUS how you bleed.

As a result you have to read the manual for every car as it can and will differ between years and models.


Moose