To all who hate DBW throttle

[dx-a]

To all who hate DBW throttle
Honda doesn't give a shit about you or me posting in this forum. The only way they will listen is if they are forced to. The agencies that have this authority are the NHTSA in America and Transport Canada in Canada. They have defect investigation procedures and have the power to force the manufacturer to issue a recall or order some other remedy. I encourage all dissatisfied owners to write to their respective authority like I did. They don't need a certain number of complaints before they can initiate an investigation, but it will help establish a valid case about this design flaw in our cars. Below is the letter I sent:

Road Safety and Motor Vehicle
Regulation Directorate
Transport Canada
Tower C, Place de Ville
330 Sparks Street
Ottawa, Ontario
K1A 0N5

roadsafetywebmail@tc.gc.ca

I am an owner of a 2008 Honda Civic DX-A, manual transmission,

I am writing to report a poorly designed Drive-by-Wire system, which, regardless of its fuel economy and emissions benefits, results in serious driveability problems, makes the car difficult to control and is therefore potentially unsafe.
The throttle response is inaccurate, delayed and does not inspire confidence in the car. There is a pronounced programmed –in rev hang as the gas pedal is released, causing the car to keep going for a short moment while the driver expects the car to slow down. This is not the natural behavior of a manual transmission car where the engine retarding effect is a desired property in the overall control over the car.
In addition, there is a pronounced cut-off and surge effect while driving in first gear, resulting in difficult control over the car in slow traffic, parking garages, drive –throughs, etc. The driver cannot maintain a steady speed, as the car is constantly bucking back and forth, which is uncomfortable to the passengers and dangerous in bumper-to-bumper traffic.
I took the car to the dealer, they performed a full scan and found that the car is up to specs, and therefore is operating as designed. Honda has indirectly acknowledged the existence of this design flaw by releasing a TSB for the 2006 Civic Si in which the problem is apparently the worst. However, the TSB only slightly improved the drivability of the Si, and did not fix the problem in full, and the defect has not since been addressed in the rest of the Civic models.
There are numerous online forums, where many frustrated owners report the same issues. The database of complaints for the American NHTSA also contains several related complaints.
Honda needs to develop a better version of the software that controls the Drive-by-wire system and issue a recall. It is just a matter of time before the unpredictable behavior of their cars results in loss of property or life.

[AllShowNoGo]

Originally Posted by dx-a

To all who hate DBW throttle
Honda doesn't give a shit about you or me posting in this forum. The only way they will listen is if they are forced to. The agencies that have this authority are the NHTSA in America and Transport Canada in Canada. They have defect investigation procedures and have the power to force the manufacturer to issue a recall or order some other remedy. I encourage all dissatisfied owners to write to their respective authority like I did. They don't need a certain number of complaints before they can initiate an investigation, but it will help establish a valid case about this design flaw in our cars. Below is the letter I sent:

Road Safety and Motor Vehicle
Regulation Directorate
Transport Canada
Tower C, Place de Ville
330 Sparks Street
Ottawa, Ontario
K1A 0N5

roadsafetywebmail@tc.gc.ca

I am an owner of a 2008 Honda Civic DX-A, manual transmission,

I am writing to report a poorly designed Drive-by-Wire system, which, regardless of its fuel economy and emissions benefits, results in serious driveability problems, makes the car difficult to control and is therefore potentially unsafe.
The throttle response is inaccurate, delayed and does not inspire confidence in the car. There is a pronounced programmed –in rev hang as the gas pedal is released, causing the car to keep going for a short moment while the driver expects the car to slow down. This is not the natural behavior of a manual transmission car where the engine retarding effect is a desired property in the overall control over the car.
In addition, there is a pronounced cut-off and surge effect while driving in first gear, resulting in difficult control over the car in slow traffic, parking garages, drive –throughs, etc. The driver cannot maintain a steady speed, as the car is constantly bucking back and forth, which is uncomfortable to the passengers and dangerous in bumper-to-bumper traffic.
I took the car to the dealer, they performed a full scan and found that the car is up to specs, and therefore is operating as designed. Honda has indirectly acknowledged the existence of this design flaw by releasing a TSB for the 2006 Civic Si in which the problem is apparently the worst. However, the TSB only slightly improved the drivability of the Si, and did not fix the problem in full, and the defect has not since been addressed in the rest of the Civic models.
There are numerous online forums, where many frustrated owners report the same issues. The database of complaints for the American NHTSA also contains several related complaints.
Honda needs to develop a better version of the software that controls the Drive-by-wire system and issue a recall. It is just a matter of time before the unpredictable behavior of their cars results in loss of property or life.

yes there is rev-hang, but it's not as bad driving as you put it. it's something u adjust to, like any other car you drive, you adjust to it to where YOU the driver operate it in a smooth manner. i have no problem driving my 07 Si whatsoever.

no offense, but maybe its you that suck at driving stick. if ur having so much trouble driving it, why not change ur methods a bit to where u do drive it smoothly?

[Gonzo]

The DBW related issues do kinda suck, but from what I understand a lot of DBW cars have these issues. We could certainly voice our displeasure but I don't think Honda wil change it since it is kind of a standard by now.

Maybe if we ever get a K-Pro equivalent it might have an option to nullify some of these behaviors. I am not familiar with ECU's so that's just n00b speculation on my part.

[dorkiedoode]

i don't have rev hang. What i do have is every time im in traffic it surge and buck if im cruising in 1st or 2nd. It start bucking and surging around 8mph in first. for example if you hit 1st all the way to 3k and shift, no problem. but when u ride first to about 8mph and slow down and gas it around there it will surge. This happen only in traffic and only in 1st and 2nd. 3rd you can feel a little bit after that it smooth out.

[dx-a]

Forget it, I am wasting my time here. Carry on...

[modoko]

i hate the DBW...

[e60.deluxe]

from what ive heard, Audi is much worse. i dont think i even notice anything except when i want to rev match.

[Silver8th]

I dont have a problem with DBW or rev hang. I kinda like it.

[bizzybearfigiblue]

Originally Posted by Silver8th

I dont have a problem with DBW or rev hang. I kinda like it.

why do ppl insist on saying there's a problem b/c they can't adjust to a machine... that's like going for a sport bike to riding a chopper and complaining about how the handle bars are... that's the way it's designed, either get used to it or get something new...

/mini-rant

[Gonzo]

I see you have a DX. Has anyone here driven both the Si and non Si civic extensively? Is there a significant difference in the throttle behavior between the two especially in relation to the symptoms dx-a is describing?

[SiCivic83]

I have problems with the DBW and rev hang from time to time. I've just been doing my best to adjust to the car. If you're really unhappy with it, then bring it to the dealership or get another car.

[bizzybearfigiblue]

Originally Posted by Gonzo

I see you have a DX. Has anyone here driven both the Si and non Si civic extensively? Is there a significant difference in the throttle behavior between the two especially in relation to the symptoms dx-a is describing?

i used to work for a Honda Dealership... and no there's not a really noticeable difference except for the lack of power and lower rpms... the DBW feels the same to me...

[Gonzo]

Not that this applies to dx-a's case, but I used to have an Injen CAI, after swapping it for my X-Style SRI the throttle response was much improved. Revs dropped much faster when I lifted and would resurge faster too. Made upshifting better since I could drop the throttle in time for the shift and get back in it once I was done more effectively than with the CAI. Also made rev matching in downshifts faster and more predictable.

As to how my SRI compares with stock, hard to say since it has been soo long since I drove with the stock intake.

[Special Ringpop]

I think it sucks as well, but I've learned to live with it. I don't exactly like that, when the car is cold, when I come to a stop, and go back into neutral, as I release the clutch, the RPMs actually RISE.

[stock_07]

Originally Posted by Gonzo

I see you have a DX. Has anyone here driven both the Si and non Si civic extensively? Is there a significant difference in the throttle behavior between the two especially in relation to the symptoms dx-a is describing?

Yes, I've driven both and i feel like the Si has no issue with it, but the R18 has an issue with lag. I got use to mine but when i first got the car it was a piss off and i know what dx-a is talking about. I hope honda comes up with something to fix it but i don't think they will. I've also driven the new fit with DBW and found it has no issues.

[stock_07]

i know what dx-a is saying and he has a right to complain. All my cars i've had were manual and it took my a really long time to get use to the DBW on the R18. BTW its not easy buying a car for 20,000 and then going "hey i don't like this" and buy another 20,000 dollar car.

[AllShowNoGo]

Originally Posted by stock_07

i know what dx-a is saying and he has a right to complain. All my cars i've had were manual and it took my a really long time to get use to the DBW on the R18. BTW its not easy buying a car for 20,000 and then going "hey i don't like this" and buy another 20,000 dollar car.

it's called buyer's remorse. why buy it in the first place if u dont like it?

[AllShowNoGo]

Originally Posted by dx-a

Hard to argue with someone who has close to 16,000 posts. They must be all valid opinions on pretty important subjects, who wouldn't feel obliged to respond.
Good day!

posts are only what they are: how many times the user has posted. nothing more, nothing less.

[bizzybearfigiblue]

Originally Posted by stock_07

i know what dx-a is saying and he has a right to complain. All my cars i've had were manual and it took my a really long time to get use to the DBW on the R18. BTW its not easy buying a car for 20,000 and then going "hey i don't like this" and buy another 20,000 dollar car.

point noted that u got used to it... thanx for the clarification

[stock_07]

Originally Posted by AllShowNoGo

it's called buyer's remorse. why buy it in the first place if u dont like it?

i like my car and when i first started driving it i didn't notice the issue since i never really gave it much gas and kept shifting at 3000rpm for the first 1500km. I think the civic is a great design but the DBW on the r18 is overlooked.