Newbie guide for Manual Transmissions

[illusionstwice]

I read this, not kowing how informative it was. Just figured...what the heck. I dont understand the rev matching too much, nor do I do it. Anyway, +REP for a great write up and taking the time to do it...

[dextor]

Originally Posted by Dans_Si

Engine braking is a good thing.

I always thought rev matching for for cars (i.e. race cars) that have straight cut teeth (Dog boxes). This is why our transmissions have synro's, so you don't have to match anyting. I never have done this in all the cars I have owned.

Why use your clutch to brake when you can use your brakes to brake?
I've always believed that brake pads are cheaper than clutches, unless you get your clutches for free

Next time you downshift from, say, 4 to 3 at 3000 rpm, try bliping the throttle before you slip it into 3 and try it without bliping the throttle, you'll see what I mean.

[Tastycakes]

Rev matching can be put simply by you want to rev the engine to where you think the RPM's need to be.

Easiest way to put this for ppl that dont know how:

Ok 2nd gear. Your in neutral @35 mph, you put it into 2nd and let the clutch out, the engine goes to 6,500 rpm.
Instead of the above you rev the engine up to 6,500 rpm then go into 2nd.

[Dans_Si]

Originally Posted by dextor

Why use your clutch to brake when you can use your brakes to brake?
I've always believed that brake pads are cheaper than clutches, unless you get your clutches for free

Next time you downshift from, say, 4 to 3 at 3000 rpm, try bliping the throttle before you slip it into 3 and try it without bliping the throttle, you'll see what I mean.

The clutch should not be slipping once you let it out. The engine does the braking. Semi's use this all the time...it's called a jake brake. When they have a heavy load they use the engine to brake...

[Tom1222]

Originally Posted by Dans_Si

The clutch should not be slipping once you let it out. The engine does the braking. Semi's use this all the time...it's called a jake brake. When they have a heavy load they use the engine to brake...

It's a bit different with Semis and it isn't quite as drastic with a small econobox of a car But everyone has their style. I just never felt the need to rev match and I am the smoothest stick shift driver in the world

[Tastycakes]

Well i rev match alot cause i kinda beat on my car a bit so...

And no matter how smooth of a stick driver you are, going from 6th to 2nd @ 35 MPH w/o revmatching is way more wear than slamming a 1st to 2nd IMO.

[Tom1222]

Originally Posted by Tastycakes

Well i rev match alot cause i kinda beat on my car a bit so...

And no matter how smooth of a stick driver you are, going from 6th to 2nd @ 35 MPH w/o revmatching is way more wear than slamming a 1st to 2nd IMO.

What were you doing in 6th gear at 35mph anyway

[Tastycakes]

Originally Posted by Tom1222

What were you doing in 6th gear at 35mph anyway

Getting my 34 miles per gallon

[Tom1222]

Originally Posted by Tastycakes

Getting my 34 miles per gallon

Not getting 34mpg lugging the engine going 30 ish mph in 6th gear
Now that is most definitely not good for the engine.

[radiocontrolhead]

Originally Posted by Tastycakes

Fixed the reverse one, ty RChead.

Yea dont try to rev match until you get comfortable driving stick cause it'll be awkward at first. To fyasko1, if you want to put it into 2nd at 40 mph, the transmission wants to be at 6k or so. If you just put it into gear the transmission spins up the clutch to 6k rpm. Rev matching you use the engine to spin up the transmission instead (which is why you need to be off the clutch and in neutral)

Edit: What are the gears called? Never knew what they were called. The idler gear is the outside gear right? so whats the gear called that goes into it?

You are indeed correct. Depending on how much of a downshift it is, the syncros can have more wear and tear if you do not rev match. Basically the syncros have to spin the transmission to speed before the shift. It's done so quickly that you don't notice it. Even if rev matching is done, you can still put the same wear on your syncros if you are still in gear with the clutch depressed. To get rid of this wear, you would want to place the shifter into neutral with the clutch released while rev matching. Instead of using the syncros to spin the tranmission, you are using the engine. After you have gotten into the ball park range, the syncros can take over for those last few hundred RPMs.

The wear and tear I mention is so small that basically doesn't do much. Although if you are very aggressive with your transmission and have a double or tripple downshift problem, you will experience more wear quicker. Basically, syncros were designed to rid the need for double-clutching (what I mentioned above).

I do it regardless because I can feel that added wear on my syncros when I can hear the transimission whine to it's appropriate RPM range.

I hope I didn't confuse any of you. If I have, let me know so I can better explain.


On a side note:
I have found that proper rev matching technique yields a smoother downshift experience.

[radiocontrolhead]

Originally Posted by Tom1222

Not getting 34mpg lugging the engine going 30 ish mph in 6th gear
Now that is most definitely not good for the engine.

If he's getting that MPG, seems to me like the engine is working less.

[Tastycakes]

Yea its actually in the 40 MPG range w/ cruise control on holding that speed in 6th. If i drive it extremely nice i can get 34 mpg but i end up driving normal gettin 27-28 or beat on it and get 23.

[dextor]

Originally Posted by Dans_Si

The clutch should not be slipping once you let it out.

You're right, just like how your wheels should stop spinning if you apply full brakes, but it takes time to get there, and that's when the wear happens.

[sonej4]

I think one of the most important things is to learn the friction point for that specific clutch. If they have never driven a manual, I think it is the easiest way for them to learn.

[radiocontrolhead]

Originally Posted by sonej4

I think one of the most important things is to learn the friction point that specific clutch. If they have never driven a manual, I think it is the easiest way for them to learn.

You'll know where the friction point is... but what do you do next? what does that friction point mean anyway? What is that friction point doing under that hood?

[sonej4]

Trying to make the car go forward.lol
In all seriousness it's best to learn how to get going without using the gas. If you are on flat ground.

[Tastycakes]

That does seem like a good way to start learning stick. Just sit in the car and play w/ the clutch w/o the gas to learn how it grabs.

[sonej4]

Thats the way they taught people how to ride bikes in one of the courses I took many years ago. You get to walk the bike around just using the clutch to get the feel. I used this method to teach my wife how to drive manual. She had many people try to teach her over the years. It worked for her and she is no car person. Still doesn't like to drive a manual, but the method worked. Instead of trying to concentrate on the gas and clutch, it gives an opportunity to concentrate on how the clutch works.

[Yodums]

That's how I taught my dad as well. I broke the daily hourly lessons into 2 phases: 15 minutes of nothing but no-gas starts with only the clutch and then 45 minutes of driving around a neighbourhood. Call it boring as hell, but he picked it up pretty well.

[dextor]

That's actually a really good idea, getting the car going with only the clutch is requires a lot of muscle control, especially when engine idles at ~700rpm. If they can get the car going this way, they'd have already gotten a thorough feel for the clutch.