Are HID relays really necessary, and explain please?

20civic07 · 08-29-2007, 12:38 AM

Okay well, I had a pnp on HID on my accord then threw them on my parents car. But I debated about getting one for the civic, a whiter color temp ( 4300k ) and was wondering is a HID relay harness really necessary? I haven't really thought about the relays but I don't want to void my warranty or screw up any electrical parts. So, is the relay really necessary? I know it will be "insurance" that they wont fail, but I also need someone to explain how exactly it is wired. I have looked through past pages and also the DIY to making your own harness, but what boggles me is why do you use only one connector? I don't understand how the little "quick disconnects" connect into the ballast. Someone explain? thanks...

Wakeboarder11 · 08-29-2007, 01:20 AM

No. The stock relays and wiring harness on our car is as good or even better than the wiring harnesses that come with the pnp kit. Im using my stock wiring harness with my pnp kit and its been working fine.... well since i got it

***Izzy*** · 08-29-2007, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wakeboarder11

No. The stock relays and wiring harness on our car is as good or even better than the wiring harnesses that come with the pnp kit. Im using my stock wiring harness with my pnp kit and its been working fine.... well since i got it

The harness is there to connect to your OEM harness. It's only connected to one terminal because it only needs the "signal" to turn on. Instead of loading your harness with the high start-up voltage, it will come from the battery instead. The way the harness works is that the fuse is connected to the battery line...so, if any electrical malfunction happens between your ballast and the battery -- the fuse blows, instead of your OEM harness frying.

The quick disconnects sound like either OEM ballasts refitted for a retrofit and/or fitting into the 9006 slot. I used them for my retro, since the Denso/Koito ballast did not come with proper connectors.

achapman · 08-29-2007, 08:04 AM

I don't care what anyone says, because I firmly believe you should use a wiring harness for the ballasts. It gives you an extra layer of protection. I use 14 ga wiring for my harness, which is thicker than stock.

Orient Express · 08-29-2007, 11:07 AM

If you are using a modern PnP kit that uses a micro-processor based ballast, then the answer is No. These ballasts have a very low start-up current, and the lighting circuits in your Civic are more than up to the task to support them.

If you are a shade-tree mechanic who is using lighting parts that are salvaged from other cars, and are not sure of their design or origin, then a outboard harness with a direct battery connect is something to consider.

20civic07 · 08-29-2007, 11:42 PM

how do you tell if it is a microprocessor based ballast lol... and what is a shade-tree mechanic... i just got the one from ebay....

illusionstwice · 08-29-2007, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by achapman

I don't care what anyone says, because I firmly believe you should use a wiring harness for the ballasts. It gives you an extra layer of protection. I use 14 ga wiring for my harness, which is thicker than stock.

Couldnt have said it any better....

safe>sorry

achapman · 08-30-2007, 10:10 AM

Anyone notice that when the car is off and you turn the headlights on (low beams), the ballasts wont turn on? They just flicker for 1 second then shut off.

Does the car not provide ample wattage through the lowbeam with the car off? Not enough at least to trip the relay? (relay's on my wiring harness )

NIGHTHAWKSI · 08-30-2007, 10:14 AM

^lol. classic bad ballast problems....should have gone OEM parts. i say it all teh time. i have never had luck with aftermarket HID kits....they always seem to have a flicker after they have been on, faulty ballasts, bad connections, grounding problems, bad relays, etc....

**ethlar** · 08-30-2007, 10:44 AM

I removed a couple posts before they caused problems, lets stay civil in here

achapman · 08-30-2007, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIGHTHAWKSI

^lol. classic bad ballast problems....should have gone OEM parts. i say it all teh time. i have never had luck with aftermarket HID kits....they always seem to have a flicker after they have been on, faulty ballasts, bad connections, grounding problems, bad relays, etc....

I've used these ballasts for quite some time. It only applies when the car is off, and the headlight is switched on. Like the low beam isn't sending enough current to trigger the relay.

Or maybe it is just bad ballasts. Oh well I just won't turn the lights on when the car is off.

**ethlar** · 08-30-2007, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by achapman

I've used these ballasts for quite some time. It only applies when the car is off, and the headlight is switched on. Like the low beam isn't sending enough current to trigger the relay.

Or maybe it is just bad ballasts. Oh well I just won't turn the lights on when the car is off.

My lights come on fine with the car off

NIGHTHAWKSI · 08-30-2007, 10:57 AM

its not good to keep turning them off and on anyway and there is no need to have headlights on when the car is off. and just FYI, turn off the headlights before you shut the engine off (some people, me being one sometimes forgets) becuase it reduces ballast life.

achapman · 08-30-2007, 10:59 AM

It was only during testing that I was doing that, otherwise I wouldn't turn them on with the car off.

One thing however I forgot to check, is when we turn the high beam on, does it shut the low off?

striker_1818 · 08-30-2007, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by achapman

It was only during testing that I was doing that, otherwise I wouldn't turn them on with the car off.

One thing however I forgot to check, is when we turn the high beam on, does it shut the low off?

nope, when you flash your hi-beams, your low beams will come on if they're not already on.
But your fogs will come off.

***Izzy*** · 08-30-2007, 11:03 AM

The lows come on when the high beams are on.

Are you using a relay, achapman?

achapman · 08-30-2007, 11:14 AM

Yeah, I made my own wiring harness for both ballasts.

striker_1818 · 08-30-2007, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by achapman

Yeah, I made my own wiring harness for both ballasts.

oh yeah? how?

achapman · 08-30-2007, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by striker_1818

oh yeah? how?

They have some really nice diagrams on HID planets forums. Just followed one of them. Then for the relay trigger, I just ordered some male 9006 connectors, plugged them into the stock 9006 plug, and soldered the wires to the correct relay pins.

I thought it was a pretty easy job and just gives me peace of mind.

Orient Express · 08-30-2007, 11:25 AM

They are also called electronic ballasts. Just about any ballast manufactured after 2003 is electronic, and 100% of the PnP kits from China have electronic ballasts. But when purchasing a used ballast or a PnP kit, make sure that you are purchasing an electronic ballast by asking the seller.

Now on the "safe vs. sorry" discussion, this implies that the person being "safe" may not know enough about a particular situation to make an informed decision. Therefore falling back on an "ad hoc proctor hoc" mentality satisfies the insecurity.

Knowledge is power, and in the case of the Relay Harnesses, they are completely redundant and unnecessary in an 8th generation Civic, especially when a PnP kit is being used.

08-29-2007, 12:38 AM	#1 (permalink)
20civic07 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,335 iTrader: 8 / 100%	Are HID relays really necessary, and explain please? Okay well, I had a pnp on HID on my accord then threw them on my parents car. But I debated about getting one for the civic, a whiter color temp ( 4300k ) and was wondering is a HID relay harness really necessary? I haven't really thought about the relays but I don't want to void my warranty or screw up any electrical parts. So, is the relay really necessary? I know it will be "insurance" that they wont fail, but I also need someone to explain how exactly it is wired. I have looked through past pages and also the DIY to making your own harness, but what boggles me is why do you use only one connector? I don't understand how the little "quick disconnects" connect into the ballast. Someone explain? thanks...

08-29-2007, 11:07 AM	#5 (permalink)
Orient Express Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 288 iTrader: 0 / 0%	The real answer is "It Depends" If you are using a modern PnP kit that uses a micro-processor based ballast, then the answer is No. These ballasts have a very low start-up current, and the lighting circuits in your Civic are more than up to the task to support them. If you are a shade-tree mechanic who is using lighting parts that are salvaged from other cars, and are not sure of their design or origin, then a outboard harness with a direct battery connect is something to consider.

08-30-2007, 10:44 AM	#10 (permalink)
ethlar n00b retro whore Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 9,451 iTrader: 3 / 100%	I removed a couple posts before they caused problems, lets stay civil in here __________________ 8thCivic FAQ\|NEW Marketplace Rules

08-30-2007, 11:25 AM	#20 (permalink)
Orient Express Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 288 iTrader: 0 / 0%	What is a microprocessor based ballast? They are also called electronic ballasts. Just about any ballast manufactured after 2003 is electronic, and 100% of the PnP kits from China have electronic ballasts. But when purchasing a used ballast or a PnP kit, make sure that you are purchasing an electronic ballast by asking the seller. Now on the "safe vs. sorry" discussion, this implies that the person being "safe" may not know enough about a particular situation to make an informed decision. Therefore falling back on an "ad hoc proctor hoc" mentality satisfies the insecurity. Knowledge is power, and in the case of the Relay Harnesses, they are completely redundant and unnecessary in an 8th generation Civic, especially when a PnP kit is being used.

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08-29-2007, 01:20 AM	#2 (permalink)
Wakeboarder11 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Yorba Linda, CA Age: 19 Posts: 1,009 Tyler iTrader: 4 / 100%	No. The stock relays and wiring harness on our car is as good or even better than the wiring harnesses that come with the pnp kit. Im using my stock wiring harness with my pnp kit and its been working fine.... well since i got it

08-29-2007, 08:04 AM	#4 (permalink)
achapman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Chicago, IL Age: 24 Posts: 304 iTrader: 0 / 0%	I don't care what anyone says, because I firmly believe you should use a wiring harness for the ballasts. It gives you an extra layer of protection. I use 14 ga wiring for my harness, which is thicker than stock.

08-29-2007, 11:42 PM	#6 (permalink)
20civic07 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,335 iTrader: 8 / 100%	how do you tell if it is a microprocessor based ballast lol... and what is a shade-tree mechanic... i just got the one from ebay....

08-30-2007, 10:10 AM	#8 (permalink)
achapman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Chicago, IL Age: 24 Posts: 304 iTrader: 0 / 0%	Anyone notice that when the car is off and you turn the headlights on (low beams), the ballasts wont turn on? They just flicker for 1 second then shut off. Does the car not provide ample wattage through the lowbeam with the car off? Not enough at least to trip the relay? (relay's on my wiring harness )

08-30-2007, 10:14 AM	#9 (permalink)
NIGHTHAWKSI Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: long island Age: 22 Posts: 12,684 Ian iTrader: 12 / 100%	^lol. classic bad ballast problems....should have gone OEM parts. i say it all teh time. i have never had luck with aftermarket HID kits....they always seem to have a flicker after they have been on, faulty ballasts, bad connections, grounding problems, bad relays, etc....

08-30-2007, 10:57 AM	#13 (permalink)
NIGHTHAWKSI Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: long island Age: 22 Posts: 12,684 Ian iTrader: 12 / 100%	its not good to keep turning them off and on anyway and there is no need to have headlights on when the car is off. and just FYI, turn off the headlights before you shut the engine off (some people, me being one sometimes forgets) becuase it reduces ballast life.

08-30-2007, 10:59 AM	#14 (permalink)
achapman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Chicago, IL Age: 24 Posts: 304 iTrader: 0 / 0%	It was only during testing that I was doing that, otherwise I wouldn't turn them on with the car off. One thing however I forgot to check, is when we turn the high beam on, does it shut the low off?

08-30-2007, 11:03 AM	#16 (permalink)
*Izzy* Supreme Pizza! Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Azusa, CA Age: 25 Posts: 11,938 iTrader: 5 / 100%	The lows come on when the high beams are on. Are you using a relay, achapman?

08-30-2007, 11:14 AM	#17 (permalink)
achapman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Chicago, IL Age: 24 Posts: 304 iTrader: 0 / 0%	Yeah, I made my own wiring harness for both ballasts.