Test drive fr-s and 8th gen Si back to back - Page 2 - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum
8thCivic.com

Go Back   8th Generation Honda Civic Forum > Welcome > Garage

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-14-2013, 10:34 AM   #21 (permalink)
Member
 
AZ8GEN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doeboy211 View Post
I'm keeping my si as my dd. I've been looking for a sports car for under 35k and I keep coming back to used vettes like Ryker stated. Performance vs money, you just cant beat them. I wouldnt buy the frs or brz because of the lack of power and I dont plan on tracking that much anyway. I already own a slowish, great handling, reliable car, my si lol
I would go with a Mustang GT, more fun to fix up and less expensive for parts and insurance.

Sent from my Galaxy S3
AZ8GEN is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 01-14-2013, 12:04 PM   #22 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
labowsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Van isle
Posts: 302
R18 Crew Member #670
Quote:
Originally Posted by w00t692 View Post
People do mind getting into a car that looks like the fr-s and brz and being completely underwhelmed with the power. If the only people buying them are autocrossing then that car and platform IS in trouble. Because very very few people do that. It's hilarious that people think because it handles well but lacks power it'll do fine like the miata.

The miata weighs 2450 lbs. The fr-s weighs 2700 lbs.

I'm looking at dyno's and it looks like the 2.0L in the mx-5 is capable of outputting it's rated horsepower and torque AT THE WHEELS with simple intake and exhaust mods with a tune. So this means with simple modifications the mx-5 would be a blast to drive and be faster than the fr-s.
yeah but the mx-5 is FWD, you fools just want power and wrong wheel drive.
compare this to other rwd, like i did to my 240sx, it may not be as powerful but it sure as hell handles better stock.

btw i highly doubt people will buy this just for autocross by the way it handles, it works great for a drift car and i would take it over a v8 mustang or vette just because of handling.
labowsky is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 12:10 PM   #23 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
vf1si's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Vtakistan
Posts: 4,078
Bow chika bow wow
Quote:
Originally Posted by labowsky View Post
yeah but the mx-5 is FWD, you fools just want power and wrong wheel drive.
compare this to other rwd, like i did to my 240sx, it may not be as powerful but it sure as hell handles better stock.

btw i highly doubt people will buy this just for autocross by the way it handles, it works great for a drift car and i would take it over a v8 mustang or vette just because of handling.

Uh oh...
vf1si is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 12:17 PM   #24 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Russell764's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 448
R18 Crew Member #905
The Mazda miata mx5 is rwd.... My girlfriend could tell you this and she knows nothing


Sent from my iPhone using AutoGuide.com Free App
Russell764 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 12:42 PM   #25 (permalink)
Member
 
AZ8GEN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russell764 View Post
The Mazda miata mx5 is rwd.... My girlfriend could tell you this and she knows nothing


Sent from my iPhone using AutoGuide.com Free App
Lmao!!!!! Im dieing...

Sent from my Galaxy S3
AZ8GEN is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 12:47 PM   #26 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
labowsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Van isle
Posts: 302
R18 Crew Member #670
Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ8GEN View Post
Lmao!!!!! Im dieing...

Sent from my Galaxy S3
haha **** i was thinking about the mx6 for some reason :P
went full retard.
labowsky is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 01:20 PM   #27 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Ivtecdou?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Eglin AFB
Age: 25
Posts: 725
Stephen
I'd rather buy a v6 mustang over the frs/brz. You can get one pretty much fully loaded for that price.


Sent from my iPhone using AutoGuide.com Free App
Ivtecdou? is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 01:21 PM   #28 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Arlington, VA
Age: 29
Posts: 6,272
Quote:
Originally Posted by labowsky View Post
yeah but the mx-5 is FWD, you fools just want power and wrong wheel drive.
fecurtis is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 01:41 PM   #29 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
eunos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 229
Ivan
Boy oh boy, the signal to noise ratio in this thread is dismal. Im going to ramble and hopefully clear some things up. First my background:

Bought my FA5 in 2008 after test driving it back to back with NC MX5. The NC was a slightly better sports car, but completely overpriced in Canada at 31k for LSD model before taxes, whereas the Civic had a better interior, better engine/transmission, better sound-system and was 30k out the door. I was coming from the first gen Miata (NA), two of them technically. I had a 1991 JDM bone stock and a monster boosted 240whp beast. I liked cars but had no driver training and the turbo miata while thrilling, was too much for both my lack of driving ability and no tools/wrenching experience (**** kept breaking).

Fast forward 4 years, 60 000km on the civic, I have been nesting in my garage for something rwd and sporty. I have outgrown my civic and rather than develop a compromised sporty car I decided to move to a proper sports car. The civic has been really good to me, faultless as a DD, I have obtained my race license in it, done a couple trackdays, countless autocross days, hillclimbs and have moved to instructing and running trackdays. I have driven everything...probably over 60 different cars in the last 4 years. Everything from stock MK1 to MK5 GTi to 500 hp race cars and ferraris. S2ks, every generation miata both NA, supercharged, turbo'd, M3's...etc. After countless hours of research and a couple test drives, I picked up an FRS. It came down to either an FRS or an S2k, and given that an S2k that I would be happy with would cost me as much as a brand new FRS, except used, with mileage, possibly questionable past owner history and the hassle of obtaining the color combination I wanted...it was an easy choice.

Now some facts:

1. Best steering feel of any car I have driven on track since a ferrari with only s2000 coming close. The snot stiff excuse for stock tires mask this a little, put some proper tires on it, hell even the stock Si michelins and the car wakes up even more.

2. Sitting position is perfect, after the minivan high sitting position of the stock Si, I am in heaven. You are nice and low, with decent support from a stock seat (I had a Sabelt bucket, bolted low in the Si so it was great support in the Si as well).

3. The car in Canada costs the same as an Si, and less than a similarly equipped MX5. For an apples to apples comparison, an S2k would be 20k more, new. The FRS is on a different level compared to an MX5 speed wise, not even a comparison. Even in autocross. Wont even bother arguing this, do your research and you will see this.

According to a trackrat I know, who owns both he says the FRS with same tires and mods is as fast as the S2k. The S2k shows a clear power advantage in lower gears whereas the FRS catches up with superior aerodynamics and slight braking advantage. Personally, I love driving both immensely.

4. The engine is great, but sounds bland, especially after the glorious k20. The k20 has more pickup, but that could be because the Toyobaru has a heavy ass flywheel. Overall raw straight line speed they feel about the same. I like the induction piping into the interior, it may not develop dynamically in sound like the k20 but some sound in the cabin always feels nice.

It has shown 160-170whp dyno-ed, given driveline losses considering RWD this is right on the money power wise. This is a compromise engine, unlike the S2k. The direct injection was added for efficiency sake, hence the 30mpg, so its not purely all out performance. It has shown plenty of promise with bolt-ons already. The S2k is expensive to make NA power with, the best bang for buck on an S2k is standalone with a good tune. The k20 is a superior motor compared to the older s2k motor, and has more potential. I mean 40whp with boltons and a basic tune out of NA k20 is pretty amazing.

5. If you think this car is going to "fizzle out" boy are you mistaken. There is a 3-6 year wait for it before they even start getting them in Australia. In my region there is a 6 month wait apparently. They cannot make them fast enough. Toyota did a killer job with the rolling the hype machine over the last 5 years. Anyone who follows cars have been exposed to every iteration of the concepts that have developed.

6. I loved my SI and have always said it is the perfect DD, EXCEPT the little FWD detail. If you do not track/autox your car, for regular DD duty this car might not be a big difference for you. For me its a godsend and has everything I wanted and nothing I don't.

7. Its fast, its popular and it has a huge active aftermarket backing with parts pouring out. Its easy on consumables and with a couple of small mods will be a giant killer at trackdays
eunos is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 01:42 PM   #30 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisiana
Age: 28
Posts: 10,677
Stephen
From what i've seen it has NOT shown promise with bolt-ons. The only thing adding quite a bit of power from what i've seen is being tuned on E85. otherwise it's only a few horsepower here and there.
w00t692 is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 02:27 PM   #31 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisiana
Age: 28
Posts: 10,677
Stephen
I think we'll see what they can do all motor soon if a good header comes out for them. Otherwise i think it could be a while...
w00t692 is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 02:37 PM   #32 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Leonard1818's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: OH
Posts: 10,110
Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by eunos View Post
7. Its fast



Leonard1818 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 07:55 PM   #33 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 534
Quote:
Originally Posted by eunos View Post
The S2k is expensive to make NA power with, the best bang for buck on an S2k is standalone with a good tune. The k20 is a superior motor compared to the older s2k motor, and has more potential. I mean 40whp with boltons and a basic tune out of NA k20 is pretty amazing.

6. I loved my SI and have always said it is the perfect DD, EXCEPT the little FWD detail. If you do not track/autox your car, for regular DD duty this car might not be a big difference for you. For me its a godsend and has everything I wanted and nothing I don't.

7. Its fast, its popular and it has a huge active aftermarket backing with parts pouring out. Its easy on consumables and with a couple of small mods will be a giant killer at trackdays
I had to laugh a bit because I think you are mistaken on a few points

F20C potential 700+whp > K20 potential 500whp or so depending on turbo
F20a potential ....350-450 maybe? More towards the 400ish side of things and Im not too confident about the ring lands either

The F20c starts with alot of things maximized so making power on it takes carefully selected components for NA power -- the K20 is choked down by the factory tune and parts so even crappy designed parts open it up - it also has iVTEC whereas the F20c does not -- you can add it for more power if need be and gains on turbo F20c have been in the 40-50whp range - cam tuning works

That being said the FA20 in the BRZ is a grocery motor with high compression and direct injection --- crappy ports, small cams and not much hope NA - I would imagine breaking 200whp with it to be EXTREMELY expensive whereas an S2000 puts that down stock

The low tech motor in the BRZ will need boost much in the way the 350z does since the motor is hopeless NA - the cams, the heads ...just dont flow without $$$ work so your better off boosting it money wise.

Calling a BRZ fast is laughable as well -- at best someone might call it decent but nobody has ever described it as fast - my FA5 felt much faster and Im damn near stock - of course I did have a heavy salesman with me on the test drive

The tires on the BRZ are crap - no doubt - but I think thats part of the allure of hooligan drift boys taking the car and chewing through crappy tires in VONS parking lots....800 treadwear craptatic tires FTL for handling

When they tested an FRS against a crappy 2012 Si with HFP stuff the Si was slightly faster around a track -- given that a K24 will belch out hp with slight mods and have much more torque the FRS is gonna need some help....that 160ish whp vs 220-230whp in an Si with mods and similar weight?

Your gonna have to cam the FA20 motor in that thing and have standalone tuning plus a good header and a good exhaust -- cams + install and even a port/5 angle valve job wont be cheap on the thing

Its a great car - alot of fun out of the box and a decent looker -- but without boost its just a so-so platform --- granted its tough finding a cherry S2000 but they are out there and if you want to track a car it doesnt have to be perfect to begin with.

There is a local guy who tracks his and is considering selling it for maybe 15-16k for an 06 with small mods -

If your talking new - I understand your purchase fully and was why I test drove it to begin with - a light weight RWD japanese car with a backseat for 25k -- a no brainer right? But the little things plus the crappy boxer motor just made it a no go for me -- considering I want to mod it I had to take into consideration the strength/potential of the stock powerplant which turns out to be weak on both counts. The local shop I get my work done is building one up and they are using the FA20 which is interesting to me as the normal 2.0L turbo motor would have been my choice --- but understandably they are trying to offer things to the avg guy trying to up his tobaru -- boost will be in the cards for sure - just no way around it with such a lazy motor
SergEK is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 08:02 PM   #34 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisiana
Age: 28
Posts: 10,677
Stephen
it's true for the most part. Except one thing. So far i've seen that just E85 on the FA20 can make nearly 200 whp. Matter of fact, the dyno i saw showed 195 whp from just e85 and tune.
w00t692 is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 08:10 PM   #35 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 534
Quote:
Originally Posted by w00t692 View Post
it's true for the most part. Except one thing. So far i've seen that just E85 on the FA20 can make nearly 200 whp. Matter of fact, the dyno i saw showed 195 whp from just e85 and tune.
Thanks to the high comp but where can they really go from there? On normal pump I just dont see them going much above that - they are at 12.5:1 comp lol

I hope I am wrong and they find a way around the ECU like the Z -- it took forever for bolt-on Zs to make power because the ECUs would just learn around the tunes and go back to stock fueling lol

But on 91 pee water at 165-170ish where are they gonna find 40-50whp when they are at such high comp? Cams/header/exhaust/intake and probably valvetrain and port work --- but I didnt know they E85'd one - did they say what they used for engine management?
SergEK is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 08:18 PM   #36 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Michael_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: SoCal
Age: 19
Posts: 964
Michael
I test drove the 2013 si, it sucked. The clutch and brake was like really close to each other, and it felt so weird lol
Michael_ is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 08:44 PM   #37 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
eunos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 229
Ivan
At no point did I mention boost and I tried to allude that NA, and low power are more than fine. Im also not building a drag car, and I assure you no one tracks an s2k with 700whp regularly, unless they want to wrench on it in the pits all the time, deal with major heat soak and issues and high maintenance. Im talking about the guys who do a hardtop, square setup, wing and bolt ons and pound out laps all day, chasing GT3's... Just for the fun of driving. Ive had more fun pounding out laps in a 120whp miata than a students 700hp Shelby GT500.

This car is as fast as "your" fa5. Simple, thats a fact, but it doesnt have the same feeling of speed from the engine. The car will do 14.8 consistently in the 1/4 much like the Si. More importantly, the car was designed from the ground up to be a proper sports car, albeit on a budget. The civic on the other hand is a hopped up grocery getter (a bandaid solution if you will, a sporty car but no sports car), and this comes through in the dynamics instantly. This car will always have way more potential, and pleasure of track driving than the Si (which I have owned, praised, and enjoyed immensely). Im sorry there is no comparison. Lower CG, lower weight, wider stance, superior aerodynamics, stiffer chassis, superior weight distribution all give the Toyobaru an inherent advantage from basic physics. Put them on the same tires, the Toyobaru will walk away effortlessly, cost you less on consumables and be much more fun to drive. Just the steering on this car sold it to me.

The toyobaru is great already, add 30hp and take out 100lb and it will be perfect. Much like the s2000 needs very little to be perfect. I learned a long time ago: the thrill of horsepower wears of quickly and is way too expensive to be worthwhile. More horsepower might give you faster lap times but makes you no better as a driver, and you cant take that with you from car to car. I simply intend to build on the great base that toyota and subaru have engineered and modify the parts that they were limited on by the budget so the car can be driven to the track, driven every day and take 30 min lapping sessions without any issues.

Benchracing about the motor is silly as well. I dont know (and dont care, no offence) how long you have been around, but I joined the site when I first got the car late 2008. Even though the car was out for 2 years at that point, there was no tuning then, hondata hadn't even released the basic flash and few people had broken through to 200whp NA. There was no Go-Power, there was trial and error and people who got lucky in assembling the right parts or terrible piggy backs. It always starts like that, except the toyobaru has the support of the industry even more than the Si. 91 Toyobarus at Tokyo Auto Salon, thats an industry record. Like it or not, this car is selling like hotcakes and everyone wants a slice of the aftermarket pie. Im sure there will be plenty of people who will figure out how to get an easy, cheap and reliable 30-50hp NA within a couple years, much like the Si. And thats all I need

Last edited by eunos; 01-14-2013 at 08:47 PM.
eunos is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 09:22 PM   #38 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Spoony's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Posts: 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergEK View Post
The S2000 is hands down a better RWD 2.0L car and can be had for much less money than a new BRZ
You reference a car that's no longer made while quoting me pointing fingers at Honda for failing to make anything for the enthusiast...you obviously failed to grasp the point.

I love me some S2000 but the fact is it's not made anymore which is exactly the point - the S2000 was a fantastic drivers car and it got axed by the same bean counters that made the new civic the gong show it is today.

The BRZ is a car pointed at fun on a budget - we need more cars like this.
Spoony is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 09:32 PM   #39 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
High plains drifter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: newfoundland
Posts: 302
only i know that.
My older brother drove an FRS auto this past summer(20min test drive,perks of owning a Tundra TRD).He said everything about the car was better than mine(loved the stock tires=slide,seating,steering feel) except the motor.No slouch for power(had it up to the C-note effortless).But the motor didn,t excite like the K20.He may buy one down the road as a daily driver if the work local pans out.Price is reasonable(funny thing they had three models at the dealer not sold,and one was a demo(FRS auto he took a spin in).Won,t buy a demo,you know that motor was beaten hard before break end.

Last edited by High plains drifter; 01-14-2013 at 09:34 PM.
High plains drifter is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-16-2013, 03:35 AM   #40 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 534
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoony View Post
You reference a car that's no longer made while quoting me pointing fingers at Honda for failing to make anything for the enthusiast...you obviously failed to grasp the point.

I love me some S2000 but the fact is it's not made anymore which is exactly the point - the S2000 was a fantastic drivers car and it got axed by the same bean counters that made the new civic the gong show it is today.

The BRZ is a car pointed at fun on a budget - we need more cars like this.
You also glossed over the fact that I said for a NEW car I understand his purchase. I too was in the market for this car until I drove it and was disappointed.

The S2000 is a better car in every way over the BRZ - the only difference is the availability of a NEW one.

For someone who is going to thrash a car at a track I dont think a "new" car vs a slightly used car is a big deal - there are plenty of slightly used S2ks out to grab one - there is an AP1 that made 240+whp recently with bolt-ons - again - the motor in the S2000 has plenty to unlock with the right combination of parts.

Anyway - he thinks they will find a "cheap" 50whp NA out of a crappy motor -- good luck and best wishes - I hope he is right - I really do

But I have been playing with Hondas since about 1996 and the reason the 8th gen civic was slow to mods was the change to how the ECU played a role in management -- the fast guys use OBD1 ecus and old tech to tune - the thousands upon thousands of enthusiasts were the OBD1 market - not the 8th gen

Add in weight, cost, insurance and other tidbits like increased wheels and tire costs and there was little reason for someone to want an 8th gen over an EG or EK

Today you can reasonably buy an 8th gen, buy used mods, search the forums and upgrade the car to 700+whp if you want much like any other Honda - bring money

But you have a base of Honda K series tuners to pool resources and efforts to make the mods effective and research.

You simply dont have the numbers with a tobaru - which means mods will remain high even after some time has passed - the Z suffered the same fate even though they sold 10x more than what is planned for the tobaru

Time will tell but as I have said - with Nissan and Honda working on turbo motors for future models - the Silvia and new S2000 will be turbo and RWD when they are released in the future - both mean this NA FA20 is no match as everyone knows the Silvia and S2000 can more than handle their own on a circuit.

Ive been around SoCals japanese tuning scene for quite some time and love to see kids try to explain the virtues of japans latest and greatest lol I was reading OPTION magazine when the EG copies were NEW lol

Its a great japanese car - the body especially the Rocket Bunny kit looks sick and is another great option for guys wanting to run a RWD japanese chassis -- the 2JZ car that was built is EPIC and probably a tell tale of what many guys will do with this chassis and I suspect we may see some with F20/22s in them eventually as we see Hachi Rokus having....

And when you talk about how "superior" this FRS is over an Si - keep in mind that the 2012 Si HFP model was faster - even being wrong wheel drive and stock power

I bought an FA5 for the 4 doors - had no intention of track days with it - but the interesting thing about the FA5 and times at buttonwillow - they are on pace with S2000 times and while obviously FWD has its weaknesses the FA5 chassis isnt exactly flimsy - its stiffer than a DC5 and made for a great R Civic building platform. They have been built to run UNDER 1 miniute at Tsukuba - 58 seconds 5Zigen 2010 Super Lap battle -- That was faster than a 680hp GTR

Ive heard the "wrong wheel drive" thing for a LOOOOONG time - my track experiences proved to me while there are some inherent strenths and weaknesses in all platforms - tuning and driving matter most -- Ive perhaps outdriven RWD drivers with my FFs so many times I chuckle in pits when I hear how bad FF cars suck....

FF cars are a technique - but they can handle just fine - dynamics are one thing - the monkey behind the wheel is a whole other subject --

2013 Subaru BRZ vs. 2012 Honda Civic Si HFP - throw this into youtube where the amazing RWD BRZ is a tenth slower around a track then a weaksause FWD car lol

My old hatches around 2300lbs with 180-190whp kicked the crap out of alot of rwd cars on down hill runs - I was able to be more confident and put more power down than alot of these guys with RWD cars - Im not saying the car was amazing but more drivers will have more confidence in an FF setup than a loose RWD setup and being able to coax more speed out of a car is a matter of confidence in how things will play out.

I get it wrong in a FF car - it pushes, I can catch it relatively easy
I get it wrong in a FR car - rear end comes around, spin or worse.

Can skilled drivers push harder, sure - but we are talking about your avg buyers/driver/monkeys

I just put 225s (RS3s) on my FA5 and continue to be impressed by this porky thing - its not an EG on 225s but for a porky FWD sedan I am impressed at its limits - I have no plans of getting rid of it because I need a 4 door car and I refuse to buy a 3600lb+ boat unless its a C63 -- so I enjoy the lighter dynamics it has over the other cars in its class -- I toyed with the BRZ as a replacement but again - was so undewelmed by the little things that the money I would have to drop to get into one seemed ridiculous. Keep in mind my local Subaru dealer is asking for pre oders and 3 thousand over sticker - plus having to shell out money for my FA5 as a trade in with high miles.

I owned a track 350z for 5 years on 295 rears with 265 fronts (180 AA) and brembo brakes - so Im not just some little FF fanboy talking about RWD cars with no experience - I had the Z sideways quite a bit - sometimes when I least expected it - and while it was easy to catch knowing there could be times when your looking out the side windows rather than the intended windshiled direction keeps you a few notches lower on the "if this goes bad, where will I end up" scale.

Fun car - loved RWD and torque - but again - I had more fun in my much lighter hatches on R compound tires than I did with the porky Z. Thus my search for a light RWD japanese car choice.

Hell there was a time before the Z I wanted to just grab a miata, hard dog roll bar it, stuff sus and wheels on it and have fun....but stuff like trunk space for luggage, long drive comfort etc... get in the way

Thats the unfortunate compromise road cars make - vs dedicated track toys

The BRZ/FRS/GT make a case for basic RWD japanese fun and learning the dynamics of RWD safely and at much slower speeds and power levels BUT they did not reinvent the wheel and designed this car "loose" to be a teaching car. It is not a scalpel as people might think. The S2000 is much more precise and has much higher tolerances and performance as such, its a more expensive car.

But I would prefer a successor - a small Supra, turbo S2k, Silvia car with tuned performance in mind from the original design. beefy trans, motor and diff with a sexy shape, huge wheel wells and a lightweight coupe body.

The BRZ has the body and thats about it --- great, affordable car hands down -- a great used platform guys can tune later

But I know there are guys itching for a turbo rwd japanese car with potential to hit 4-500whp on stock block and having the drivetrain to handle it and the space to fit tires big enough to put it down.

Something along the lines of a japanese Z4

Anyway - like I said before - I understand the purchase and Im sure youll have fun with the car - keep us posted on mods if you make any. Id be looking into the Rocket Bunny kit - sooo sick
SergEK is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Magnaflow cat back with test pipe knighj1 Exhaust Discussion 0 01-09-2011 10:28 AM
Time to drive back to Va ItsKoniac89 Civic SI 5 02-16-2010 11:18 PM
Axle back pops after a drive. [hwy]Hagen Mechanical Problems & Technical Chat 7 01-16-2009 11:55 AM
Test drove SI back-to-back with MINI Cooper S mslatter Dealership Experience 60 06-01-2008 03:06 PM
Just got back from my 1st test drive.... tcd2004 Dealership Experience 6 03-11-2008 08:03 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:04 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.
copyright 8thcivic.com - all rights reserved