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Old 12-03-2012, 01:56 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Hybrid Racing Cables Problem.

Here is the story. Installed twn stage 2 short shifter and is was great. wanted better bushings so I installed the corsport cable bushings it was a very solid setup up until I bent my oem cables. I order new hybrid racing cables and this time taking my time and installed them to the tee. no problems. So the story begins, Im going crazy now, it seems the cables have a lot of play in them. up and down and side to side. on the daily drive it gets very annoying.
anyone have issues with these cables and or a fix, maybe a adjustment??

help!
here is a video




I'm almost at the point where i want to go back to oem cables with cable bushings.
I know these cables can withstand a lot of abuse but the sloppy shifter is driving me insane lol

Last edited by Hondafa5; 12-03-2012 at 02:00 AM.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:08 AM   #2 (permalink)
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The cables shouldn't have that much play at all! If you installed the correctly they should feel A LOT better then stock.. something is wrong for sure, check to see if anything came disconnected. Also contact hybrid racing they are a bunch of very nice people over there and would be glad to help you get to the bottom of your problem.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:20 AM   #3 (permalink)
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They have play in them while in gear or neutral?
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:31 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks, i just sent them an email tonight. Hopefully they can help me out.
I double checked all the connections from top to bottom. under the car and brackets to the cables going into the car next to the cat. everything looks good. also checked where the cable locks into place on the shifter all correct.
just play in neutral. as stated before with oem cables and corsprot cable bushings the shifter was so solid and direct. problem was with that setup i installed the bushing on the trans side upside down and bent my cable trying to get the bushing off.. if you have ever installed bushings they are tight, you may get them in but forget about getting them out..

here is a pic of my corsport cable bushings on my oem cable after hours trying to get them out lol. It actually was working fine with out a cotter in it and being upside down before i tried to get the bushing out to re install the correct position.then bent my cable.

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Old 12-03-2012, 02:39 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Similar issue i had a few times. See how loose the 19mm nut is on top of the shifter assemby. You have to play with it to get what you want from it. And loctite it down it you want.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:40 AM   #6 (permalink)
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The cables shouldn't have that much play at all! If you installed the correctly they should feel A LOT better then stock.. something is wrong for sure, check to see if anything came disconnected. Also contact hybrid racing they are a bunch of very nice people over there and would be glad to help you get to the bottom of your problem.
If you look when i slide left and up and down you can see the metal slide like its loose. so weird.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:41 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Similar issue i had a few times. See how loose the 19mm nut is on top of the shifter assemby. You have to play with it to get what you want from it. And loctite it down it you want.
i contacted twn about their short shifter thinking that was the problem at first but they replied saying that the shift is solid and it has to be the cables.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:49 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Try it. Make sure all your bolts and nuts are tight. Especially that 19mm on the shifter assembly. It helped me out. The lock nut has weak rubber. It loosens up easily. Tighten it down with a lock washer and/or loctite. I got mine with a lock washer and paint marked on top to make sure it doesn't loosen again.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:54 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Try it. Make sure all your bolts and nuts are tight. Especially that 19mm on the shifter assembly. It helped me out. The lock nut has weak rubber. It loosens up easily. Tighten it down with a lock washer and/or loctite. I got mine with a lock washer and paint marked on top to make sure it doesn't loosen again.
You are talking about the TWN SS right?

I have tried tighten and loosing it up. problem with that is when its too loose the shifter does not rebound and when its to tight it does not work right. What do you think. and how long did you mess with it to get it right, what other bolts are you referring to? all the base bushing are tight and then there is only the spring and to Allen bolts/

man i tell you, after spending hundreds of dollars on a full replacement ss and cables this sucks.. hope twn or hybrid racing help me

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Old 12-03-2012, 03:48 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I just sat there and messed with that nut for a few minutes to get it at the desired play I wanted it. Lock washered it anf marked it. I am sure there is a torque spec to it but who has one of those in their garage?
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Old 12-03-2012, 12:23 PM   #11 (permalink)
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We're glad to help however we can. Perhaps you can take a video that illustrates where you are seeing play? The best method we have always recommended for finding the source of play is to have someone hold the counterweight on the tranny tight while someone gently moves the shift knob around (careful here as if you are too aggressive the counterweight can move an pinch the person holding it). Follow the play from the knob through the shifter and cables and see where you stop noticing play. We have sold several hundred sets of these cables and have had no issues with play. We have also sold several thousand sets of our similar RSX cables. I doubt the play is in the cables, but we'll try to help you find the source of it.

~russ
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Old 12-03-2012, 12:32 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I'd bet despite what they're saying the play is in the shifter. Listen to russ and have someone wiggle the shifter counterweight.
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Old 12-03-2012, 04:12 PM   #13 (permalink)
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We're glad to help however we can. Perhaps you can take a video that illustrates where you are seeing play? The best method we have always recommended for finding the source of play is to have someone hold the counterweight on the tranny tight while someone gently moves the shift knob around (careful here as if you are too aggressive the counterweight can move an pinch the person holding it). Follow the play from the knob through the shifter and cables and see where you stop noticing play. We have sold several hundred sets of these cables and have had no issues with play. We have also sold several thousand sets of our similar RSX cables. I doubt the play is in the cables, but we'll try to help you find the source of it.

~russ
Thanks Russ. I will be calling u guys soon. But for now did u see anything in the video that sparks interest or a diagnosis ?
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Old 12-03-2012, 04:31 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Thanks Russ. I will be calling u guys soon. But for now did u see anything in the video that sparks interest or a diagnosis ?
Do as I described earlier and follow the troubleshooting method I laid out. To me, the play does not look to be too far from the normal. There may be a little extra play coming from somewhere, but you have to understand that the transmission (internally) naturally allows some play. This is because without the play, you the forks could not be operated smoothly and getting from one gate to another would be very difficult. You the best way to see if that's what the play is is to see if the counterweight on the transmission wiggles when you wiggle the shifter. If the counterweight wiggles, you know the play is coming from within the transmission.

Please follow some of these troubleshooting methods I've discussed in my 2 posts here before calling, as we will not be able to provide any additional help without first knowing your findings from that.

Also, if you have not yet installed the transmission springs we provide with the cables, you should consider doing that too. From there, I would do as suggested earlier and look for looseness in any of the components in the shifter.

~russ
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Old 12-03-2012, 04:53 PM   #15 (permalink)
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In neutral sliding left and up and down. as in the first video about half way through you can see in it in cabin. now here is the video of the tranny side..
I did install the springs that came with the kit. had no issues installing these as well. help!
ps im all alone with a 2 week old baby, so dont be upset that I cant hold the counter weight at the moment. can you give me a description of the counter weight and where its at or a picture?


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Old 12-03-2012, 05:20 PM   #16 (permalink)
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In neutral sliding left and up and down. as in the first video about half way through you can see in it in cabin. now here is the video of the tranny side..
I did install the springs that came with the kit. had no issues installing these as well. help!
ps im all alone with a 2 week old baby, so dont be upset that I cant hold the counter weight at the moment. can you give me a description of the counter weight and where its at or a picture?

image
I can't speak of the front/back movement as I can't see the pin for that cable in your video, but the side/side movement appears to be coming from the transmission. Notice how the arm on the transmission moves with the cable as you move the shifter left to right. It's possible that you simple didn't notice this play in the transmission with the OEM cables due to added friction or something along those lines. For the cable with the spherical bearing, make sure you're using the correct insert for the bushing. If you have an 07+ and are using the larger 06 insert, that will add a bit of play.

On our shifters, we use stiff centering springs to give a very stiff centering action. This helps to make the shifter feel more firm with less play, even with the truth is that the transmission has some play in it as we are seeing in your video. Since your current shifter uses the OEM centering spring, it makes noticing this transmission play easier.

Also, the counterweight is the large, trapezoidal block of metal that hangs off the lever on the transmission that the shift cable attaches to.

One interesting note: You would not have noticed a lot of the play in the transmission when you had your solid bushings installed because solid bushings cause the gate selection cable (the one controlled by left/right movement of the shifter) to bind up. This binding makes the transmission seem like it's got no play, when the reality is you simply can't feel the play because you're fighting the solid bushings.

~russ
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Old 12-03-2012, 05:49 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I can't speak of the front/back movement as I can't see the pin for that cable in your video, but the side/side movement appears to be coming from the transmission. Notice how the arm on the transmission moves with the cable as you move the shifter left to right. It's possible that you simple didn't notice this play in the transmission with the OEM cables due to added friction or something along those lines. For the cable with the spherical bearing, make sure you're using the correct insert for the bushing. If you have an 07+ and are using the larger 06 insert, that will add a bit of play.

On our shifters, we use stiff centering springs to give a very stiff centering action. This helps to make the shifter feel more firm with less play, even with the truth is that the transmission has some play in it as we are seeing in your video. Since your current shifter uses the OEM centering spring, it makes noticing this transmission play easier.


Also, the counterweight is the large, trapezoidal block of metal that hangs off the lever on the transmission that the shift cable attaches to.

One interesting note: You would not have noticed a lot of the play in the transmission when you had your solid bushings installed because solid bushings cause the gate selection cable (the one controlled by left/right movement of the shifter) to bind up. This binding makes the transmission seem like it's got no play, when the reality is you simply can't feel the play because you're fighting the solid bushings.

~russ

So do you think a stiffer centering spring will help? do you stock these?
I am using the 07+ insert but have been contemplating putting the 06 in to see if it help im so sad right now.. full replacement shifter, full replacement cables and crap loose in gear and out of gear so sloppy What can I do?
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:49 PM   #18 (permalink)
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So do you think a stiffer centering spring will help? do you stock these?
I am using the 07+ insert but have been contemplating putting the 06 in to see if it help im so sad right now.. full replacement shifter, full replacement cables and crap loose in gear and out of gear so sloppy What can I do?
If you are using the 07+ insert, then you are good. The 06+ is larger and will cause more play.

Not sure what to tell you here. The play that I am seeing in the 2nd video you posted appears to be from the tranny. There may be more play coming from something else that is not in the video. Get someone to hold the counterweight like I've been suggesting. That will help you to diagnose this further. Having designed quite a few shifters over the years, I can say there's plenty of play that can be caused by a shifter if it starts with play or wears out.

We do not make stiffer OEM style springs for the shifter. Our shifters use a totally different spring design.

Also try a light knob if the one you have is reasonably heavy. Heavy knobs can make play feel more noticeable.

~russ
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:09 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I finally got to watch your video. Looks pretty normal to me. if anything it's either the transmission or the shifter. If you move the shifter like that and you can have someone verify it's moving at the other end...
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:43 PM   #20 (permalink)
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What a trouble this has been. TWN says its cables , hybrid says it shifter or trans.. Let me state I had none of these issues with stock shifter, didn't have the problem with twn shifter and stock cables , now I have the problem with hybrid cables and twn short shifter.. What a mess.
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