LX Owner finally test drives an Si

[Rawhyde]

Originally Posted by splew

You did autoX in your LX? No brake problems? My brakes just fade away just driving stop and go in the florida summer heat.

I ran the LX

The brakes worked fine. I didn't have any issues with fading on the course, nor in daily driving. The brakes OK for a daily driver, but if there was a practical way to retrofit Si brakes, I'd do it in a pair of seconds!

I wish Honda would come out with a new model. How about an LXS? Take an LX, add the Si suspension and brakes, and let it roll on some 16" aluminum wheels. Great reliability, gas mileage, and good handling/braking... Surely, I'm not the only person who'd buy one like that. No development costs, and minimal costs to produce. Price it smack between the LX and EX...instant profit for Honda and another choice for customers!

Rawhyde

[splew]

^^^ I know the regular coupe models have stiffer shocks and springs than the sedan already and some of the Si's stiffer suspension is to offset the extra 300 or so pounds, so I don't know if the Si's suspension is really all that much stiffer than an R18 coupe's. I have another idea for a new model though, the EX-S, give it the 160hp K20Z2 from the Acura CSX, give it a slightly softer Si suspension, Si brakes and 17 inch wheels and 215 tires.

[saiaba]

Originally Posted by Rawhyde

I've had my LX since March 10th of this year. I've racked up about 6500 miles on it so far. I finally got an opportunity to test drive a Civic Si today.

Here's my observations of the differences...

The Si has a good exhaust sound. It's not loud, but it has a nice pleasant sound to it.

The Si has far superior steering. The LX has ZERO feel and feedback. The Si has a much better feel. Too bad the Si uses an all electric power steering system that'd make a retrofit impossible.

The Si has superior seats to the LX. Much firmer and more supportive.

The brakes in the Si are much more responsive and the pedal feel is more linear. Like the steering, I hear that upgrading an LX to Si brakes is nearly impossible. I know there are plenty of BBK's out there, but nothing beats the easy availability of spare pads and rotors of OEM on a car that gets 40K+ miles per year.

Suspension wise, the Si is far superior also. None of the "floaty" pillowcloud ride like the cheaper versions have. The stock LX suspension purely sucks. I added the Si swaybars at 1600 miles, and that ain't enough. I'll be getting the springs/shocks within a week or so. The Si achieves a good balance between ride quality and comfort. To be honest, I was expecting something much harsher and darty. I'm anxious to meet up with my seller to get the springs and shocks now!

The transmission in the Si had a much crisper shifter. It just felt right with its crisp chort throws.

The difference in the engines was less dramatic than I expected. It seemed a little more peppy and it certainly sounded better than the LX. The salesdude kept telling me that I wasn't driving it right. He insisted that I rev it hard. So at the next stop, I ran it up to 4000 rpm between shifts. It's stronger than the LX, but he said that it had to be revved much higher to feel the difference. So I stopped and revved to ~7500 between shifts. IT REALLY WOKE UP!! When you spin it up, the Si will scoot!

Is it worth the price difference? Yes and no. With my long history of low revving cars, it's hard for me to let something wind up like that, but if I could go back in time, I'd have the Si instead of the LX.

I inquired about swapping cars with him. I was hoping to swap for maybe $1500-2000 more than the price differential between the two models. My car is only 6 weeks old afterall. They wanted $8945 before the taxes and other BS hidden fees were added. The Si is the superior car, but it ain't $10,000 better.

Congrats to all the Si owners! Y'all bought the right car. I tried to go cheap...

Rawhyde

You should get an Si if you like it.

Originally Posted by I Vtec, do you?

I used to have an LX, the two dont' really compare at all other than sharing the same visuals between each other.

I agree, the suspension flat out sucks on the LX, yet everyone likes to disagree with me. And yeah, the SI isn't very quick at all unless you really rev it up, so if you don't want to do that, I wouldnt' get the SI.

If you sold the LX privately, you could easily buy a low-mileage used SI for ~17-18k. It'd be worth it, imo.

Do this and buy my SI.

Originally Posted by splew

Uh dude every R18 owner wishes they had an Si. Too much $$$ to buy and too much $$ to insure though.

It's not that bad to insure.. I wasn't really proud to pay 20k for a civic, and I just found out this week there is no low windshield washer fluid light

either that or mine is broken .. heh.

[splew]

Originally Posted by saiaba

It's not that bad to insure.. I wasn't really proud to pay 20k for a civic, and I just found out this week there is no low windshield washer fluid light

either that or mine is broken .. heh.

Insurance might not be a big deal for you at 26 but I'm only 18 so my rates would be much higher.

[knowledge_6]

Originally Posted by sohcBOOST

that suck man. i get 35 easy

well if ur gonna buy an Si.. your knowing that ur spending more on gas ...

i get about 9-10 KMPL so that's about 22-23 MPG.. that's vtec'ing at least 3-4 times a day.. and just driving it..

[ironman1964]

Originally Posted by Rawhyde

I wish Honda would come out with a new model. How about an LXS? Take an LX, add the Si suspension and brakes, and let it roll on some 16" aluminum wheels. Great reliability, gas mileage, and good handling/braking... Surely, I'm not the only person who'd buy one like that. No development costs, and minimal costs to produce. Price it smack between the LX and EX...instant profit for Honda and another choice for customers!

Rawhyde

Can't see Honda wanting to add yet another trim level to a model that already has so many. It would be cool if it could be an option to order it with different suspension, brakes, etc.

[chenslee_cheese]

You can buy all the parts to put EX disks on an LX for about $850. Aside from the obvious disk, pads and calipers, you will need the knuckle and hub from an EX. The ABS sensor may need to be changed too.

Your best bet is to find a crashed EX and reap it.

Converting an LX or EX to Si brakes is another heap of OMG alltogether. You will need new front knuckes, front disks, and front calipers, (and possibly a new front hub) for the EX to Si converson, PLUS all the LX to EX hardware as well for an LX to Si conversion.

[splew]

^^ that's what I thought too but a bunch of other people say you're f**ked if you want to you a drum to disc. I think It sounds pretty strait forward but until I see someone do it I'm hesitant to do it myself.

[JchanFTW]

I actually did the reverse of you and drove a EX coming from my Si. I gotta say I loved it and is a much better DD. Anyone want to trade?

[JeShUa]

I'm sure if you're serious you can find someone.

[dmnall]

I will admit the first time I drove an Si was an 06 coupe at Vista honda and I was not impressed because the ride was like my camaro and my dads Vette, too stiff and I was coming from a smoother ride from the gto I had. Once I drove an 07 Si sedan, I was hooked because the ride was a lot better and the power was pretty damned impressive for a small car! I ended up driving an accord exl v6 navi m6, scion tc, integra gsr, 08 Civic Lx manual, cobalt ss *non supercharged*, Saturn Ion Redline *pos in my opinion* but I kept going back to the Si and ended up getting an 08 Si Sedan! So I say if you are wanting the Si, I would just try to negotiate a better price and get it! As for the comment of Insurance being higher and gas mileage being worse then an dx, lx and ex.. I say try insuring a 98 - 02 LS1 F-body or 04 LS1 GTO or 05 - 06 LS2 GTO! Then deal with the gas mileage... Since I owned an 02 LS1 Camaro Z28 Auto with 2.73, I would get 18 in town and 32 on the freeway until the ls1 had developed Piston slap all the time and then it went down to 12 - 14 in town and 14 - 20 on the freeway because the engine was running too rich in cylinders 3 and 7!... The insurance when I was 23 - 26 years old was 130 a month at the higest and 120 at the lowest a month with no tickets or accidents since I was 16 years old.. The GTO would get 14 - 16 in town *depending on how I drove it and would get 24 - 27 depending how I drove and the gto was 50 a month when I first got it and went up to 69 a month with no tickets or accidents on my record before all the bs that went down with it.. So the insurance on the Si Sedan is 43 a month and the gas mileage is pretty damned good considering almost 300 miles out of the 13 gallon tank! I have 2 speeding tickets to fight, however, I guess that was my punishment for having a yellow car that looks like I was speeding! All I know is I am completely happy where I can drive 70 miles to go visit my g/f and know that I am not burning a 1/4 tank one way as well as the Si sedan is a lot cheaper overall versus my gto! My payments went down 300 a month along with a lot less gas bill!

Charlie

[KShirza1]

if your into cars then the Si is not even a question... you will have to use premium on the high compression motor, 2.0 that runs rich in higher power band will give you lower MPG unless you shift at recomended 4k, and obviousley more road noise with the lower pro tires vs stock EX.

the R18 is good but IMO only in the EX form since you get rear disc and some sound goodies. since the c ar inst front heavy it actually performs better in tight ssituations like autox.

for the people that get the LX/DX and join a enthusiast forum and start spending thousands of dollars on such a stripped down econo car is weird IMO. this is why honda offers a Si... not to play with peoples emotions or anything, if you joined a car forum and are looking to mod you should be drivig an Si or better.

in the world of the hobby a civic is entry level and the Si is bargan compared to anything in its class or price range... food for thought

screeming 2.0l engine with ironed flat power band, phenominal interior, 6 spd tranny with LSD, etc... EX/LX/DX seem like a distant cousine.

[JeShUa]

If you join a car enthusiast forum you should be driving a WRX or better. WTF is a 15 second 1/4.

[2000civic]

Originally Posted by splew

Insurance might not be a big deal for you at 26 but I'm only 18 so my rates would be much higher.

Im 19 and live in Cali. I pay 190 a month. It was 230, but for some reason it went down this month. My old 2000 auto 4door ex was 190 a month also. I get roughly the same gas milage as the ex as well.

[kobel4k3r5]

Originally Posted by Rawhyde

The difference in the engines was less dramatic than I expected. It seemed a little more peppy and it certainly sounded better than the LX. The salesdude kept telling me that I wasn't driving it right. He insisted that I rev it hard. So at the next stop, I ran it up to 4000 rpm between shifts. It's stronger than the LX, but he said that it had to be revved much higher to feel the difference. So I stopped and revved to ~7500 between shifts. IT REALLY WOKE UP!! When you spin it up, the Si will scoot!

that's a real salesman right there.

[marc-o-lishuz]

Originally Posted by Rawhyde

Congrats to all the Si owners! Y'all bought the right car. I tried to go cheap...

LOL Awww...

[splew]

Originally Posted by dmnall

I will admit the first time I drove an Si was an 06 coupe at Vista honda and I was not impressed because the ride was like my camaro and my dads Vette, too stiff and I was coming from a smoother ride from the gto I had. Once I drove an 07 Si sedan, I was hooked because the ride was a lot better and the power was pretty damned impressive for a small car! I ended up driving an accord exl v6 navi m6, scion tc, integra gsr, 08 Civic Lx manual, cobalt ss *non supercharged*, Saturn Ion Redline *pos in my opinion* but I kept going back to the Si and ended up getting an 08 Si Sedan! So I say if you are wanting the Si, I would just try to negotiate a better price and get it! As for the comment of Insurance being higher and gas mileage being worse then an dx, lx and ex.. I say try insuring a 98 - 02 LS1 F-body or 04 LS1 GTO or 05 - 06 LS2 GTO! Then deal with the gas mileage... Since I owned an 02 LS1 Camaro Z28 Auto with 2.73, I would get 18 in town and 32 on the freeway until the ls1 had developed Piston slap all the time and then it went down to 12 - 14 in town and 14 - 20 on the freeway because the engine was running too rich in cylinders 3 and 7!... The insurance when I was 23 - 26 years old was 130 a month at the higest and 120 at the lowest a month with no tickets or accidents since I was 16 years old.. The GTO would get 14 - 16 in town *depending on how I drove it and would get 24 - 27 depending how I drove and the gto was 50 a month when I first got it and went up to 69 a month with no tickets or accidents on my record before all the bs that went down with it.. So the insurance on the Si Sedan is 43 a month and the gas mileage is pretty damned good considering almost 300 miles out of the 13 gallon tank! I have 2 speeding tickets to fight, however, I guess that was my punishment for having a yellow car that looks like I was speeding! All I know is I am completely happy where I can drive 70 miles to go visit my g/f and know that I am not burning a 1/4 tank one way as well as the Si sedan is a lot cheaper overall versus my gto! My payments went down 300 a month along with a lot less gas bill!

Charlie

Dude LS2 GTOs are so sweet....

Originally Posted by KShirza1

if your into cars then the Si is not even a question... you will have to use premium on the high compression motor, 2.0 that runs rich in higher power band will give you lower MPG unless you shift at recomended 4k, and obviousley more road noise with the lower pro tires vs stock EX.

the R18 is good but IMO only in the EX form since you get rear disc and some sound goodies. since the c ar inst front heavy it actually performs better in tight ssituations like autox.

for the people that get the LX/DX and join a enthusiast forum and start spending thousands of dollars on such a stripped down econo car is weird IMO. this is why honda offers a Si... not to play with peoples emotions or anything, if you joined a car forum and are looking to mod you should be drivig an Si or better.

in the world of the hobby a civic is entry level and the Si is bargan compared to anything in its class or price range... food for thought

screeming 2.0l engine with ironed flat power band, phenominal interior, 6 spd tranny with LSD, etc... EX/LX/DX seem like a distant cousine.

I put 17s and Si size tires on my LX to replace the piece if crap A/S bridgestones it came with and I also added premium speakers and an 8 in. sub, both things the Si comes with stock, but I still haven't made up the cost difference between the LX and Si. I am thinking about upgrading the sucky brakes but you are probably right in that it will be cheaper for me just to get an Si.

[wwwJDMarKc0m]

Can I just ask...? whats so Great about the LX? I mean is it any good at all?

[splew]

Originally Posted by wwwJDMarKc0m

Can I just ask...? whats so Great about the LX? I mean is it any good at all?

Yeah I have an LX and I definitely like it, I sometimes just wish for more.
Pros:
Great gas milage, I get 34-37, most owners on this site get 30-33.
Safety, dual front, dual side, and dual side curtain airbags standard, good crash tests.
Reasonable price, MSRP is just under 17 grand.
Decent sound system. 160 watt six speaker(for coupe) four speaker(sedan)
Pretty good acceleration for manual, okay acceleration for Auto
Pretty good handling on the coupe (stiffer shocks and springs than sedan) if you buy a set of performance tires.

Cons:
Brakes suck. Puny discs up front, punier drums in back.
Stock tires suck. Poor traction on dry pavement, worse on wet (aftermarket performance summer tires work very well though)
Stock wheels suck. 16 inch. steel wheels and plastic covers.