EM1 CMC Warning/Advice Read before Install

[parrowman]

Originally Posted by belizetj

I think i will adjust it a little higher and see what happens.

what ever you do just make sure the piston isnt compressed ANY when the pedal is out.

[belizetj]

Yeah. Thanks for the advice. I dont wanna adjust it too high and burn up my clutch. That would suck.

[belizetj]

Well i adjusted the clutch switch bolt, or whatever u call it (the one that stops the pedal from going any higher), about a mm from all the top.
I adjusted the pedal bracket and lock nut on the cmc rod all the way up until the pedal barely tapped the clutch switch bolt (trial and error, A couple threads).
Then i readjusted the clutch switch bolt, or whatever u call it, the rest of the way up. So there is a mm of play in the clutch pedal. The piston isnt compressed any.
The clutch used to clamp about half way up. Now its about 1/4 way up. I guess because the rod got longer.
I can powershift 1st to 2nd @ 7800 wot if i shift really fast. It still grinds 1st to 2nd powershifting @ 8k and above. I can regular shift 1st to 2nd @ wot any rpm, above 8k too. I can powershift all the rest of the gears wot at any rpm.

I adjusted the cmc as best i could, and i think the grind from 1st to 2nd powershifting above 8k is due to my broken boomba mounts or a worn clutch, maybe a little of both. I will start by replacing the boomba mounts.

[nttdemented]

Ok I have the Hybrid kit standing to get installed and I swapped the rods out but I used the rod retainer of the OEM CMC with the tabs. I did the blow test on the pump and I can blow through both directions when the rod is resting in its natural position. If I push it in a little bit (like 5mm) I can no longer blow through the pump. Am I good to go or should I still swap out the rod retainer for the EM1 one without the tabs still.

[w00t692]

you should take the one with the tabs off and put the em1 cmc one in there.

[parrowman]

[nttdemented]

Originally Posted by w00t692

you should take the one with the tabs off and put the em1 cmc one in there.

Look like I'm going to have to go borrow the snap ring pliers again at my buddy's shop. Good think I asked before installing it as I was planning on doing the install tomorrow morning.

[Igotlostagain]

Ordered the EM1 CMC from hybrid-racing and the SS comes with it now $175 shipped.

Going to do this Sunday and this is what I got through this thread, let me know if i'm wrong..

[integra15]

Check the last couple pages of this thread

Everyone with an Si should see this...

[JEBSi]

There is a bump stop (switch) at the top of the clutch pedal and it is adjustable. The switch is for cruise control and it might have to be adjusted so the clutch is not pushed in at all. You should be able to feel good play in the pedal with your foot before it starts to compress the cmc piston. I had to adjust my switch alot. I let the pedal rest all the way out and then tightened the switch down on it, so that the switch was just barely being activated and then if the clutch pedal even gets grazed it shuts off the cruise control and this is how it should be to remind you to get your foot off of the clutch pedal when trying to use cruise control, plus this is usually how they are set from the factory.

On the other end, the bottom of the pedal travel, the pedal should bump stop on the floorboard and the piston should be all the way in as far as it can go without bump stopping on the pistion itself, which is adjusted with the bracket and rod.

Attached is the file for perfect adjustment and yes that is the correct combo above.

Biggest install tip would be to get the clutch line elbow pointed the perfect direction coming off the cmc with maybe a little more bend in the elbow (seriously), the lower the profile of the elbow the better, and it is very important to tighten the clutch line all the way down on the cmc so that it will even fit into place which is the toughest part of the whole install and I hope you got a good left hand! Also once you have the clutch line installed and all the way tight on the cmc, try not to have to take it back off and try not to move or flex on that plumbing during the install otherwise you risk a leak in a blind hard to access spot. Also, a good idea to properly bench bleed the cmc before the install so that you don't have to deinstall because you can't get the system to bleed correctly. Very tough spot to install and with some tipage you might get away with squirrelling your left arm to the install location a lot less. Also brace the clutch line well with the line clip that comes in the kit otherwise the pedal will have v-tec vibrations. I had to bend my clip with a vise to install it in a good position to clip the line without pulling on it. Lastly, while you are in there, lube the springs for the clutch pedal return with a plastic safe thick lube.

To bleed the clutch system -
1- fill reservior with fluid
2- open the bleeder at the slave
3- push pedal to the floor (no return)
4- close bleeder valve
5- lift pedal off of floor
6- repeat until no air bubbles are present (a tube from a one man bleeder kit will show bubbles).

You should now be able to see the slave cylinder pin moving the clutch fork and when you try to start the car it won't roll forward because the cmc is installed correctly, if not the car might roll forward on startup or if the bottom switch is not adjusted correctly the car will not even start.

[nttdemented]

Originally Posted by JEBSi

There is a bump stop (switch) at the top of the clutch pedal and it is adjustable. The switch is for cruise control and it might have to be adjusted so the clutch is not pushed in at all. You should be able to feel good play in the pedal with your foot before it starts to compress the cmc piston.

THIS!!!

I installed mine a few weeks ago and I never saw any info posted here on the pedal stop switch, I had to adjust mine a lot since I had adjusted it for my OMNI CMC. But, in contrary to what JEBSi is saying you don't need it to just graze the pedal when its completely out, the pedal can be resting on the bump stop with the switch completely depressed, cruise control will still get disengaged with a very minor movement of the pedal. It gets disengaged when any movement is detected on that switch.

Just to add more info to this thread I'd like to add my install and adjustment process:

Install and Bleed:

1. Remove the CMC, Slave, Reservoir and line from the car.
2. Transfer the necessary parts between the EM1 CMC and the OEM CMC.
3. If you see black residue on the bottom of your reservoir or inside your slave I'd strongly suggest to clean the reservoir, reservoir line and inside of your slave with some light detergent and let them dry out in the sun. A can of compressed air will help blow out any watter out of the slave and reservoir line. Use some brake fluid around the rubber seal on the slave's piston to help it go back into the slave cylinder without damaging it. Use some good lithium or heavy bearing grease on both ends of the slave's fork engagement rod.
4. Install everything back onto the car and leave the clip that holds the reservoir line tight onto the CMC lose.
5. Adjust the pedal switch all the way out so that the pedal can extend completely.
6. Adjust the rod to make sure that the piston is completely disengaged.
NOTE: Step 5 and 6 are to make absolutely sure that the cmc is completely open.
7. Pour some of your brake fluid of choice into a clean glass jar.
8. Slip a clear tube over the slave cylinder's bleeder nipple and let the end of the tube rest completely submerged in the fluid you poured into the glass jar.
9. Fill the reservoir with brake fluid to the top.
10. Slip your hand into the corner where the CMC is and slip the reservoir line slightly off the CMC and feel when brake fluid starts pouring out through the line. (You should see the level in the reservoir go down a little bit). And slip the reservoir line back onto the CMC.
11. Now that the reservoir line is primed and fluid is reaching the CMC open the bleeder valve on the slave with the tube attached. Make sure the tube remains submerged in the jar.
12. Look at the end of the tube that is in the jar and you should see air bubbles slowly coming out of it and the reservoir will be going down slowly as well.
13. Keep pouring fluid into the reservoir until no bubbles are seen exiting the end of the tube inside the jar. This process is called gravity bleeding, it should take about 15 - 30 minutes for gravity to do it's thing. If you have access to a pressure bleeder it will speed up the process but it isn't necessary. A pressure bleeder blows the fluid down on the reservoir with a little compressed air and it forces the fluid through the system faster than gravity can.
14. Close the bleeder valve on the slave.
15. Have someone press the clutch pedal about 5 times. You should see the clutch fork moving.
16. Instruct your helpful person to hold the clutch completely on the floorboard and open the bleeder valve until the fork comes back to it's resting position and close it again.
17. The pedal will remain on the floor. Instruct your helpful person to pull the clutch pedal back up with his foot.
18. Repeat step 15 - 17 about 3 or 4 times or until you don't see any bubbles coming out through the tube at the bleeder valve. Since this is a gravity bleeding method there should be very little air coming out through the tube even on the first try. Any air that comes out is air left inside the slave witch should be minimal.
19. Don't forget to install the clip that holds the reservoir line onto the CMC once you're done.

Adjustment:

1. Start the car IN NEUTRAL.
2. With the clutch pedal completely depressed, try to shift into the different gears. It should feel almost effortless when you switch gears. If it doesn't feel effortless or if you can't even get into any gears you have to extend the rod more so that the clutch disengages more.
3. Now that you can get into your gears correctly put the car into 1st and slowly move the clutch pedal out and feel where the clutch engages. You can have the clutch engage further up on the pedal travel or further down. Personally, I adjusted the rod until only half an inch of movement was required to engage the clutch. If you like your clutch to engage higher up you'll have your clutch pedal sitting way higher than the brake pedal, I didn't find this comfortable but this can be adjusted to taste.
4. Now that your engagement point is adjusted you can move the switch/bump stop down onto the pedal until there the rod is almost touching the piston but without actually touching it. I set it up so that there is virtually no dead pedal slack. It takes a few tries but I was able to get it to a point where you barely feel the slack with your foot but you can definitely feel it with your hand when your down there. A little slack is important to make sure the pedal isn't riding the clutch when it is at rest!
5. Take the car out for a spin and try to do a WOT shift from 1st to 2nd at the redline. It should go into gear VERY EASILY. If it does not, you have to lengthen your rod adjustment a little more and adjust your bump stop switch accordingly using the guidelines in step 4.

And... ENJOY!!

After driving around for about 10 months on the OMNI CMC I can honestly say that the EM1 CMC also makes shifting just as effortless with no lockouts or grinds whatsoever. The main difference between the EM1 and the OMNI is that the OMNI CMC is a LOT harder to push and the pedal stroke is around half of what the EM1's is so the pedal rests a lot lower. I very much liked my OMNI CMC and I could shift a little faster with it but the EM1 is a perfect balance! And being OEM it should be 100% reliable. I had the OMNI CMC replaced by OMNI 3 times.

[Igotlostagain]

I believe that my CMC is either sucks or the Syncro's. If this doesn't fix my grind issue in first gear at 2-3 RPM's on cold start and no WOT, power shifting, speed shifting, etc. Only makes the noise once in a while, not every cold start. After 10 minutes of driving it doesn't make the noise.

Had the Clutch Pedal adjusted to stock and engages and i'm not slipping.. yet.. and hope i don't after this EM1 Upgrade =]

[Igotlostagain]

Okay i know there are people that are visual learners so correct me if something is wrong in this photo =]



Information derived from Every Si Owner Should Read This

[integra15]

I think you have the wrong retainer plate pictured.

[nttdemented]

Originally Posted by integra15

I think you have the wrong retainer plate pictured.

Correct, that is the OEM retainer plate. The EM1 retainer has a smooth round dish without the inward tabs.

[Igotlostagain]

That's hybrid racing photo cropped and using the photo for reference but relying on the words


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wickedsickdood]

I just did this today. I used the oem retainer plate because I thought it fit better with the oem rod. I tested both in the em1 cmc and I thought that was fine. They both had wiggle room before it started to compress. I also used the oem bracket fork and with the em1 lock nut. I had the rod thread all the way in the bracket that the lock nut would allow and looks to be perfect to where you can see that the rod is backed all the way to the retainer plate. I wish I used the oem lock nut just to see how it would be with more thread to back the rod even more but it still seemed unessesary. The pedal does release higher than oem.

[dakidizsofly954]

after doing the swap idk if it is normal or not, Lets say i crossover vtec and press the clutch i feel like pulsation?,vibration? its basically like i feel the tranny? i dont know how to explain it. I followed all correct instructions and bled everything the only thing left is to adjust the clutch pedal as in my opinion it engages way too high but im not sure if thats how its suppose to be?

[JEBSi]

Originally Posted by dakidizsofly954

after doing the swap idk if it is normal or not, Lets say i crossover vtec and press the clutch i feel like pulsation?,vibration? its basically like i feel the tranny? i dont know how to explain it. I followed all correct instructions and bled everything the only thing left is to adjust the clutch pedal as in my opinion it engages way too high but im not sure if thats how its suppose to be?

You need to clamp the clutch cable with the clip that came in the kit, if you got a hybrid racing kit. I bent my clip so it would bolt up under the cpu and I put a plastic zip tie near the slave cylinder.

More clutch cable clips = less pedal vibration.

[dakidizsofly954]

i didnt buy the kit, i just bought the cmc and used the oem line..is it necessary to use a SS line? If i take it to honda will they be able to adjust it to oem spec?