3rd Gear Solution under way

[Vinc84]

The Fix

This is in concern of the pretty huge 3rd Gear problem that 06 - 07 Civic SI owners are experiencing - myself included.

My original post about my experience with the 3rd Gear issue can be found at the Edmunds post:

Long-Term Road Tests - 2006 Honda Civic Si: Popping Out of 3rd Gear

I will just copy&paste what I've posted on there concerning a fix for this 3rd Gear issue:

vinc84 - Dec 4, 2007 7:09 am (#26 Total: 32)

Tuesday December 04 2007 - 9:45am

Hello to all you other '06-'07 owners and to you curious would-be Si-owners.

I am currently writing this comment from my local Honda dealership. I have experienced the sluggish 3rd gear from since the first week I purchased my '07 Civic Si. The third gear started out being a little stiff but overall shifting was smooth. After the break-in period of about 1000 - 1500 miles, it got much worse. The first 3rd-gear grind occured somewhere between 700 - 1000 miles, and thereafter I'd say I get the missed-gear and/or grind at least once or twice every two weeks...each time that it has happened it wrenched my heart.

Anyways, I'm at about 14,500 miles now and I've gotten fed up with the 3rd gear issue. Last Friday I brought my car here and spoke to the manager of the service dept. and told him all about the issue. Apparently, Honda recognizes the 3rd gear issue for both the Civic Si and the recent S2000s as well. Both cars are recommened a transmission fluid swap from the original fluid to Amsoil Syncromesh (as others on here have already stated, I am just plugging that Honda verifies and in fact recommends this fluid). So I got my transmission fluid changed to the Amsoil Syncromesh for no service fee since my car is stil under warranty. The manager told me everything should run smoothly now and to give it another try and if the same problem persists even after the transmission fluid swap, then the warranty will cover for even a transmission overhaul if it is required.

Well, I drove my Si around this past weekend and I will say positively that the transmission fluid does in fact improve the smoothness of the shifting. However, my third gear still seemed 'damaged' from all the grinds it had received before I got the new transmission fluid. Even though it's improved a lot - it still hangs a bit. And as fate would have it, while driving yesterday the third gear didn't take and it kicked my shift knob right back at me...and if I wasn't already familiar with the routine then I would have grinded the gear yet again! Upset, I brought the car back and told the service manager that the problem occured again and that even though the transmission fluid probably would have fixed the problem if I got it changed from day one - it is simply now a problem with how damaged and frayed my 3rd gear is and also how damaged the shaft that slides in and out of the gears has gotten from being chipped at from the 3rd-gear 'grindage'.

Well, the result of that long story is that I am now sitting here at the dealership while the manager is waiting on confirmation with Honda Tech to see what parts they're going to need for a transmission overhaul. My Si is fully paid off, still new, and under warranty thankfully. I am expecting that it will be fixed to the state that it should have been in when I purchased the car. We as a consumer deserve the best in performance from our Civic Sis. If you are truely concerned about the long-term health of your transmission and you are experiencing the 3rd-gear issues - then I suggest you go look into it at your dealership and get it fixed while your warranty will still cover it.

It really is a shame that some of the '06 - '07 Civic Si transmissions are faulty by default from manufacture. If you're looking into buying one, then make sure the car has had the Amsoil Syncromesh fluid put into the car before you take it off the lot...it will make your life so much easier. I'm pretty certain you won't have any problems at all if you buy the car with the Amsoil Syncromesh already in the car.

I will be posting another update with further news about my car for the curious. Good luck everyone.

Vincent T. (Maryland)
'07 Civic Si Nighthawk Pearl w/ Nav


vinc84 - Dec 5, 2007 4:29 pm (#27 Total: 32)

Okay guys, I have big/good news:

The service manager at my local dealership got the word in and told me that Honda now officially recognizes fauly transmissions for its 6-speed transmission cars - as far as '03 Civic Si all the way to recent '08 models - including S2000s, Accords, and 6-speed Acuras.

There WILL be a fix issued in January 2008 - the exact date is not announced or known yet. This is not a total recall on all 6-speeds. Cars will be addressed in a case by case basis - basically if someone has a problem and it is recognized as being related to the confirmed 6-speed transmission issues - your dealership is obligated to fix your car for you free of charge, even if your car is no longer under warranty (past mileage or years).

The fix:

I didn't get very many details but basically I was told that for the the '06 - '07 Civic Si models (maybe '08 as well) that there is a transmission kit in the works that will fix the problems everyone is talking about - basically a crappy 3rd-gear and the hanging, grinding, and rejection when shifting. The tranny fix will change the gear syncrhos for gear 1 through 6 and will fix and improve the shifting of not only the 3rd gear, but of the gear box entirely. For those of us who get this fix, they will basically give you a new transmission - new fresh gears and re-synchronized, etc. Awesome.

Conlcusion:

So, everyone who's experiencing any problems at all - nows the time to bring your Si into the dealership and bring up the problem and ask about the transmission fix that's been announced. If the manager or service worker has no idea what you're talking about - tell them to contact Honda Motor Corp and ask because they should have been updated with instructions about the coming transmission fixes - the manager I spoke to didn't know but he had the intelligence to look into my problem further to find out if there was one.

Good luck everyone, by the Jan 2008 this issue should be taken care of once and for all, so go get your Si fixed. To anyone looking into buying the Si - I suggest you wait until January comes around so that the fix takes. Just make sure you're buying an Si that has the new transmission layout and the new required transmission fluid in it.

Vincent T. (Maryland)
'07 Civic Si Nighthawk Pearl w/ Nav


steve2333 - Dec 27, 2007 8:18 am (#28 Total: 32)

Thanks Vincent,
The information you provided was needed and accurately desribed the problems I was experiencing. It saved me the bother of trying again to get my dealership to work on the problem without "replicating" it first. I read your post to the Service Manager, and then he finally understood (or accepted what I had been telling them).

Steve2333


vinc84 - Jan 13, 2008 1:47 am (#29 Total: 32)

Hello everyone it's me again, I hope everyone enjoyed their holidays.

It is now the middle of January 2008 and I haven't gotten in contact with the service manager at my local Honda dealership concerning that transmission-kit fix yet. He said he would call me when it's available but of course he probably would forget...

So, this coming Monday I'm going to probably stop by the dealership since I need an oil-change and new air-filter anyways, and while I'm there I'm going to see if the fix is available yet. I seriously hope it is because my car has gotten MUCH more sluggish since my last post. I'm now at 16,000 miles and I'm beginning to think my clutch is burnt or something. It just doesn't feel the same way anymore. Or maybe I just need that oil-change and air-filter but I doubt those two maintenances would make my car sluggish like that at all. (20% oil life, air-filter I think is recommended for change at 12- 15k miles.) It is definetly drive-train related.

I mean, when I really want my car to go fast, I can MAKE it go fast, but I feel as if I have to really press on the accelerator more lately. I don't remember having to try as hard or give as much gas for it to push, and I really don't get that "kick" when i accelerate anymore. But defintely not a full blown clutch just yet.

In either case, I've already sort of been promised by the service manager that if my clutch was worn out or entirely "burnt" then he would go ahead and associate it with the faulty 3rd gear issue. Hopefully my clutch and everything is fine, but if they're not then I hope they will indeed fix it without me having to pay for the parts or service.

Although of course someone could always say it is the driver's fault and that the driver pay for it - but in this case, since Honda is officially taking responsiblity for the faulty transmission issue - I believe they'll cover any other RELATED issues and treat it as a special case since it is highly probable that those other mechanical problems are related to the gear/shifting issues. So if you're going in to get this fix, remember to ask them to perform a full vehicle inspection in case your clutch and whatever else is screwed up.

Has anyone else already went ahead and found out more information or received the gear fix? If so, please explain to the rest of us how it went and how your SI is doing now. I'll update again after I find out more information about the fix - whether it's available or not yet, etc.

If anyone has questions or comments you are welcome to email me:

vinc@umd.edu

Vincent T. (Maryland)
'07 Civic Si Nighthawk Pearl w/ Nav


vinc84 - Jan 13, 2008 2:10 am (#30 Total: 32)

That's awesome Steve I'm glad you didn't have to wait for those service guys to replicate the scenario in their test drives. I find it probably impossible to replicate the issue unless one of them actually owned you car for a few days and drove it from cold start to run a few errands. And no one has the time or the trust to loan their car out to someone just to show them what the problem is.

It is good that your service manager took my post at face value. Originally I printed out this threat before I posted on it to show MY service manager. He tried to replicate the problem, but to no avail.

At least he knew about the Amsoil Syncromesh and changed that for me for free. But after that didn't really work to well, he found out about the transmission fix by Honda. So I'm thankful for that and I hope we all get that fix soon.

Did your service manager also learn about the transmission fix and have you received it yet or are you still in the process as well? Let me know how it goes for you, good luck.

Vincent T. (Maryland)
'07 Civic Si Nighthawk Pearl w/ Nav
email: vinc@umd.edu


vinc84 - Jan 13, 2008 3:09 am (#31 Total: 32)

If you're looking for a quick answer without reading my previous posts, I'll sum it up.

Honda has announced a transmission fix for the 06 - 07 Civic SI (and any other Honda 6-speed that qualifies for the fix). The announcement is on their official service bulletin. Any Honda dealership should be able to draw it up to see for themselves. If the service manager still fails to figure out that this is a Honda recognized, kindly ask him to contact someone at Honda Motor Corp about it and they SHOULD be able to inform him about the fix through the phone.

Again, the fix involves basically overhauling your existing transmission and changing a few of its mechanics around. THIS IS BASICALLY A NEWLY LAID OUT GEAR BOX. You will probably want this even if you don't experience 3rd gear issues because this is what Honda is putting out there as a fix and as a new transmission lay out. I suggest that if you have an 06 and 07 SI, that you bring your car in and see if the fix is necessary for you or not. Personally, I'd try to get it done just to stay up to date with the parts. Unless of course you have an aftermarket tranny or something.



vinc84 - Jan 13, 2008 4:33 am (#32 Total: 32)

On another forum someone responded to my post with:

"Where's the announcement? Do you have smething offical or is this just something that the tech said?"

Unfortunately it's not that easy to view the official Honda service bulletin. You can view service bulletins through certain websites that charge you around $20 - 30 for a detailed print out of a particular service bulletin...but I'm not going to do that when I've already been told about it personally by my dealership. Basically, I'm just sharing what I've learned about the issue from my own findings at the dealership. I've done as much as anyone can about the problem. My local Honda service manager drew up a Honda service bulletin that addresses the 3rd gear problem officially. He told me that there is a fix that is due in 2008 as early as the month of January. I was then told I he will try to contact me about it when the fix is available. I have been going to this dealership for maintenance on my old 97 Accord Coupe LX SE, 98 Civic EX, and Honda Oddysey as well as my 07 Civic SI. I am treated very well there so I don't think I was lied to. There is no reason to lie to a customer about a false fix.
Only someone at your Honda dealership can assure you about the fix if you don't take my word for it. I'm merely relaying what I was told by a professional. Again, this is why I suggesting that anyone who is experience this very same problem should also take their SI to the dealership and inquire about the problem and fix.

In either case, I'll update this forum and every other forum I have posted on about how everything goes when I bring my car for regular maintenance tomorrow on Monday. I'll speak to the service manager again to see what's up with the release of the fix. I'll post again then.

[Vinc84]

I'll let you all know what happens when I get my maintenance and speak to the service manager at my dealership about the word on the fix again. Just know that the issue has been recognized and is posted up on their service bulletin, otherwise he would not have seen it and told me about it.

If anyone else goes into the dealership about this on Monday too or whenever you do, please let the rest of us know what happened and what you heard as well.

[Yodums]

What a read. Anyways, I hope what your dealership is telling you will pan out some time this month. I think your dealership has been really nice to give you the benefit of the doubt and voluntarily offered to fix transmission-related parts under their goodwill because of the failures relating back to third gear. I know a good chunk of us, me included, won't even bother explaining this to the local dealerships. Besides, until Honda releases an official technical service bulletin acknowledging a problem and providing a direct fix related to the issue, then I won't do anything. A lot of people on these boards just simply get their transmission rebuilt. I personally don't believe that will solve anything in the long run. You're replacing defective parts with a new set of defective parts.

Again, good luck and keep us posted.

[Vinc84]

Well what I think the service manager meant when he told me about it is that this is in fact an official Honda response to the 3rd gear issue. I mean, he was on the phone with some corporate guy while I waited, then he checked the computer and then he showed me the bulletin he was seeing. Then he explained to me what will happen but that the parts are still being manufactured and won't be ready until sometime after the new year. These parts are entirely newly fashioned transmission parts to replace the old ones. It is basically like overhauling your transmission, but not replacing the whole thing entirely. I do not think they are going to be the same exact parts, because what will the point of that be?...And about the wavered service and parts fees - I guess it all depends on who is running the service department at your dealerships and how well they treat you - but my guy assured me that Honda will take care of this for me without me having to worry about the expenses. Whatever the case, I'll update later with new information. I understand the skepticism, but I'm hopeful it will work out.

[dentrecords]

Thanks for the info.. there's been a whole bunch of talk of 3rd gear fixes coming down the line recently and this is helpful too..

[mattsbobo]

[drunkrusski101]

I have a twm ss and Dc headers so my warranty is voided would they still fix my car?

[FusionSi11]

hey Vinc84...great read and definitely helpful to many people on this site. my 06 Si already has 47k miles and i read earlier on your post that even though my ar is out of warranty that Honda will still fix my transmission revampment for free? is that what Honda Corp told your service manager? im just trying to clarify this situation....

[GeezerSi]

[dentrecords]

Originally Posted by drunkrusski101

I have a twm ss and Dc headers so my warranty is voided would they still fix my car?

this isn't the thread to ask this.

and there are sticky threads created about warranties.

search for "warranty" in the thread title.

[rickhilbert]

I hope to god this happens. I have been to the dealership three times, with the same results as everyone. Time to call Honda and complain again!

[F-1 Si]

[Yodums]

Originally Posted by FusionSi11

hey Vinc84...great read and definitely helpful to many people on this site. my 06 Si already has 47k miles and i read earlier on your post that even though my ar is out of warranty that Honda will still fix my transmission revampment for free? is that what Honda Corp told your service manager? im just trying to clarify this situation....

There WILL be a fix issued in January 2008 - the exact date is not announced or known yet. This is not a total recall on all 6-speeds. Cars will be addressed in a case by case basis - basically if someone has a problem and it is recognized as being related to the confirmed 6-speed transmission issues - your dealership is obligated to fix your car for you free of charge, even if your car is no longer under warranty (past mileage or years).

I'm guessing it'll be released as a recall where all cars are considered for the fix free of charge, just like the wheel bearing recall.

[PhantomSi]

has any1 gone to a dealership to confirm this other than the OP?

[KenB]

I have an oil change scheduled at the dealer tomorrow. I've printed the OP's post and will ask the Service Manager to read it while I'm waiting. I'll report his reply when I get home tomorrow.

[liquidr1]

I had my MTF changed last week at my dealership (Flow Honda of NC) and they still pretend to be totally unaware that any type of 3rd grear issue even exists.

lol so much for a fix in Jan. 2008

[xfactorwrx]

ive never had any 3rd gear issues.

[liquidr1]

Originally Posted by xfactorwrx

ive never had any 3rd gear issues.

Iv never really had then either. I mean it got a little notchy arount 45,000 miles. But never any grinds or poping out like others complain about. Anyways when i got my new MTF put in last week it feels like a brand new tranny again.

[RosevilleSi]

bookmarked. I just had my MTF changed for the 2nd time 'in warranty' thanks to that TSB from last January. I'd love for them to issue something official so I can get this nagging problem fixed.

[r a y]

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