2nd Gear Bogging

[08silversi]

OK guys I have searched for this issue to no avail. Let me give you some background. Before getting my 08 SI I had a 90 supercharged CRX, 2002 S2000, and 2002 Corvette Z51 6 speed. I am pretty proficient with a manual and I have had some very fast cars. My shifting technique has always been to press the clutch, fully let off the gas, shift, release clutch, and give throttle. This has always been a good technique for the cars I had because of traction issues. I have also driven with the "power shifting" technique where you start to give throttle before you disengage the clutch.

The point is when driving my SI and shifting to second it feels like it is bogging even with traction control off. If I fully let off the gas when shifting at high rpm it feels like it is bogging. The only way to get around it for me it to give it part throttle, but that puts strain on the clutch. Do any of you guys ever notice this?

[Fresh-Popcorn]

My 06 Si has been having the bogging problem from around 10K miles + and it now has 37K miles.
I took it to the dealer and told them of the problem and after about 3 days of them testing it out the mechanic told the service manager that he did feel a bogging sensation once.

Now it doesn't happen all the time, maybe once in a few weeks or even once a month but when it does happen you can really notice it. Its more noticeable when your almost full throttle .
The mechanic changed the Oxygen sensor since the computer said that the engine was running a bit rich.
The problem still exist but it doesn't happen on a regular basis.

[08silversi]

Yeah my car only has 1200 miles on it so I doubt it is a defect. I think it is because of the factory light flywheel that if you release the clutch quickly right before giving it throttle when shifting it feels like it is hesitating or losing power before getting into the power band again. As long as I feather the throttle which keeps the revs up it doesn't feel like that.

[Micah]

i guess im lucky...i havent ever felt a bog...just it taking forever to run out of gear and get speed once i hit 4th...but i'll get on it and see if i feel a bog...

[08silversi]

Yeah I think it is just has to do with the way I'm shifting it. If I give throttle before fully disengaging the clutch it doesn't feel laggy. I just haven't ever had to do that with any other cars before.

[dnbsi]

Originally Posted by 08silversi

Yeah I think it is just has to do with the way I'm shifting it. If I give throttle before fully disengaging the clutch it doesn't feel laggy. I just haven't ever had to do that with any other cars before.

thats what i have to do for 1-2 shift too. if i don't it feels like it's engine breaking as soon as 2nd engages

[92gli]

My '07 started developing a 1st to 2nd bog when it hit about 8,000 miles old. It was totally random... it only did it once or twice a week. Cold and hot.

Dealer couldn't replicate. It never got resolved before I traded it for my '08.

[dnbsi]

bog means it doesn't respond to throttle right?

[06si]

i mostly feel the bogging first thing in the morning or if i haven't driven the cars for a couple of hours. Sometimes i will shift and my car will bog real bad that it will actually throw me forwards in my seat but my foot was already off the clutch for a second or 2.

[08silversi]

Originally Posted by dnbsi

thats what i have to do for 1-2 shift too. if i don't it feels like it's engine breaking as soon as 2nd engages

Yeah If I release the clutch after engaging second before giving throttle it will feel like the engine is losing power. It is only when revving over 6k though. It doesn't do it in normal driving. I'm guessing all Si's do it. I think it is a combination of the flight flywheel, low torque, and dbw.

[dnbsi]

Originally Posted by 08silversi

Yeah If I release the clutch after engaging second before giving throttle it will feel like the engine is losing power. It is only when revving over 6k though. It doesn't do it in normal driving. I'm guessing all Si's do it. I think it is a combination of the flight flywheel, low torque, and dbw.

and the high compression rate...

this always felt like a normal attribute of the car, engine breaking in those low gears hits hard. probably even more so in those high revs. i've never felt it there though, cause if i'm reving that high in first i kick the clutch in, shift and get back on the gas as fast as i can as the clutch is coming up. damn thing revs so fast in vtec in first i feel like i have to rush. i think my shifting would improve if i slow down

[08silversi]

Originally Posted by dnbsi

and the high compression rate...

this always felt like a normal attribute of the car, engine breaking in those low gears hits hard. probably even more so in those high revs. i've never felt it there though, cause if i'm reving that high in first i kick the clutch in, shift and get back on the gas as fast as i can as the clutch is coming up. damn thing revs so fast in vtec in first i feel like i have to rush. i think my shifting would improve if i slow down

Yeah it is definitely my driving style. Sometimes I can shift it perfectly and other times it feels laggy. It is because if I shifted like you do in any of my other cars the traction loss would be substantial. I once shifted a C5 Z06 like that and almost wrecked. So my style changed and I need to change for the Si as well.

[06si]

Originally Posted by 08silversi

Yeah it is definitely my driving style. Sometimes I can shift it perfectly and other times it feels laggy. It is because if I shifted like you do in any of my other cars the traction loss would be substantial. I once shifted a C5 Z06 like that and almost wrecked. So my style changed and I need to change for the Si as well.

i think going from a vette to a civic makes shifting the civic much easier and smoother. Maybe its because of the heavier clutch and how much of a PITA it is to get into the lower gears.

[volvo9]

Originally Posted by 08silversi

Yeah I think it is just has to do with the way I'm shifting it. If I give throttle before fully disengaging the clutch it doesn't feel laggy. I just haven't ever had to do that with any other cars before.

It's not you it's the car. Or to be more specifc, you have to adapt your driving style to the quirks of the way Honda programmed the DBW system.

After you shift it takes a bit for the car to go WOT again, even though the throttle is on the floor. Even when powershifting the throttle closes a bit and needs to re open. This car could be faster but the DBW screws it over.

It's the same engine as your old RSX-S but with balance shafts added. Any driveability issues you notice are from the crappy DBW system. No other car I know of is this bad. The rsx is bliss to drive, not the Si.

[typer_801]

The bogging issue IMO is a result of the DBW system and nothing else. The TSX I test drove did it too. It's particularly obvious in the SI under full throttle redline 1-2 shifts, but I feel it in other gears and throttle applications. With a few of months ownership under my belt, I'm learning to just lift less in this car under hard acceleration. It minimizes or eliminates the hiccup (with the VSA off). Related, jumped in my ITR over the weekend and drove it to the inlaws to store for th winter. Was amazed at the massively better throttle response and shifter. Don't get me wrong, the SI is a very good little car, but the shifter and DBW are real buzz killers for me on it. Otherwise, I really like it.

[08silversi]

Originally Posted by typer_801

The bogging issue IMO is a result of the DBW system and nothing else. The TSX I test drove did it too. It's particularly obvious in the SI under full throttle redline 1-2 shifts, but I feel it in other gears and throttle applications. With a few of months ownership under my belt, I'm learning to just lift less in this car under hard acceleration. It minimizes or eliminates the hiccup (with the VSA off). Related, jumped in my ITR over the weekend and drove it to the inlaws to store for th winter. Was amazed at the massively better throttle response and shifter. Don't get me wrong, the SI is a very good little car, but the shifter and DBW are real buzz killers for me on it. Otherwise, I really like it.

You have the right idea. Lifting less on the 1-2 shift is the only way to eliminate the lag. If I shift like that it pulls like it should and without doing that it feels like the engine is dieing. I actually like the shifter though. It doesn't feel as good as my S2000 did, but it feels the same as the RSX Type S to me.

[S treet I llegal]

you get bad blog when the ac is on i get it all the time 2nd gear

[vetkiller]

I would have to disagree with most of you and say that it is the driving style. This car is very, very sensitive to the timing of your shifts. If you have the proper technique and timing, she won't bog at all.

[vetkiller]

Originally Posted by S treet I llegal

you get bad blog when the ac is on i get it all the time 2nd gear

AC is notorious for this. I hit the AC and it's like my car just got punched in the stomach. I swear it loses half it's horse power.

[08silversi]

Originally Posted by vetkiller

I would have to disagree with most of you and say that it is the driving style. This car is very, very sensitive to the timing of your shifts. If you have the proper technique and timing, she won't bog at all.

Yeah I think most people are saying that due to the drive by wire you have to get on the gas sooner than other cars or you will bog. It is a combination of driving style and drive by wire. If you get on the gas before fully disengaging the clutch you are working around the drive by wire in essence.