Hondata Reflash Question

SoFLACiViCSi06 · 03-06-2007, 04:37 PM

I had a couple of people tell me with rsx's that with the hondata reflash you are lowering the RPM your vtec kicks in but the vtec doesnt pull as hard as it did before the reflash, is this true? Can someone with the reflash confirm this?

BlkonBlkFG · 03-06-2007, 04:44 PM

not true. Vtec is changed to a lower number to smoothen out the transition. This means you make more power earlier. You still feel the really hard pull around the same rpm level as stock, except now you make more power before it too.

***bossman*** · 03-06-2007, 04:50 PM

It also may not seem like it's pulling as hard because rather than going from nothing to the stronger cams you have a little more pull before you actually get to where the secondary cams make the most power.

untouchablesi · 03-06-2007, 05:03 PM

i cant wait to get the reflash

King Bob · 03-06-2007, 05:54 PM

go to hondata's web site and take a look at the dyno comparrison. On a stock Si theis a huge dip in power right before vtec engagment, ths gives the illusion of a power surge at engagement. the reflash has no power dip therfore you wont notice that surge but you will actuallybe going faster.

chullen · 03-06-2007, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoFLACiViCSi06

I had a couple of people tell me with rsx's that with the hondata reflash you are lowering the RPM your vtec kicks in but the vtec doesnt pull as hard as it did before the reflash, is this true? Can someone with the reflash confirm this?

I gained my peak power from the original 6000 rpm to redline, it kicks in hard but pulls you in the seat at 6k

Jardiniboy · 03-06-2007, 09:45 PM

The only thing about the reflash is that you would need at least a intake or exhaust

06civSi · 03-07-2007, 02:25 AM

i cant wait. i get my ecu back from them tomorrow

Skin441 · 03-07-2007, 03:02 AM

I live about 40 minutes from Hondata. I rolled by there the other day. Great company, cool guys down there. They put some extensive research into these reflashes. They could make their own microsoft software down there. I can see it now "New PC company Hondata!"
But anyways the v-tec surge is just not as prominent as it is stock because like stated in the million other threads on the reflash, when the vtec kicks in earlier the cam profile gradually builds up to where it makes its peak hp levels at high rpm's. What is gained though is the hp and torque gain getting from Hondata quote "Power is gained in the midrange from 4700rpm to 6300 rpm." Once original vtec point of 6,000 hits it has to build up which takes a bit longer. Thus all this means quicker acceleration, more linear power instead of instant hit, broader vtec range, and now a bad ass car. Just look at Hondata.com You can see the torque curve from 4700 is a nice gradual climb. This is were the motor is gaining a huge amount of acceleration. This is on my first list to do once I fit my r/t high flow cat and vibrant exhaust onto the ride in the next few months. Already have the injen cai. It is essential that you have exhaust mods this includes intake. More flow means revs build quicker and that dyno curve you see builds quicker. Some people over look acceleration rates I don't know why. Peak HP isn't always everything, torque is a huge thing to look at too. But how quickly your motor builds up to that peak HP/TQ numbers is when you see and feel huge improvements.
06civSi you won't be disappionted plus you will see the best gains possible like I said above. Really going to make the best of all those great investments you have made.
For everyone else look plz at the hondata website they say everything needed to know. If anyone has any questions about this stuff let me know. I have been apart of extensive r&d testing, as a test rider, for both Yamaha and Honda involved in Motocross/Supercross motors. Well broke my back last year and am in the rehab process to come back and race the AMA Nationals this year. For a satellite yamaha team. Bought the si for a daily driver to from gym/shop/and mostly canyon runs and track. To take place of my stolen 06 R1. I have found myself along with my motor builder diving into it every day. Have to burn time some how. For the past 4 years have seen and heard a great deal. All the same principals apply for these motors just a few more cylinders/pistons/cam lobes. Can't wait to have my mechanic pull the head and port/ lap valves/ cut valve seats/ and such then see what we can get from this nice 2 liter.

06civSi · 03-07-2007, 12:15 PM

thanks man. i cant wait. but the shitty thing is that i wake up this morning to like 3 inches of snow... i hate PA

SoFLACiViCSi06 · 03-07-2007, 12:35 PM

I have CAI and exhaust, thanks for clearing this up for me, i plan on sending out my ecu sometime this month for a reflash.

Anubis · 03-07-2007, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 06civSi

i cant wait. i get my ecu back from them tomorrow

Give some feedback/results when you do please!

AznMTboy · 03-07-2007, 02:23 PM

yea, the stock ECU program the fuel cut off for a second right before VTEC, to give it a stong KICK. So reflash you would get rid of that, well that the only to get to true power.

tommyroo · 03-07-2007, 02:30 PM

I'm still a bit confused as to why our cars might lose power if the reflash is done with a pure stock car.

Can't they just lower the vtec enagement point without screwing with other settings?

Skin441 · 03-07-2007, 02:39 PM

Because it needs to breath when running with this setting. You r car does a million things at once you are unaware of. Reading from the MAF, i.e. temp, flow, barometrics, then to exhaust the burning of the fuel it then correspondds to timing and fuel delivery. Stock is for stock ecu. Moding is for Hondata reflash.
Opening up the motors program means giving it more air and allowing to release quicker. Go jog around the block..you feel good right. Well then go pound 2 red bulls and sprint with a paper bag over your mouth. getting a good picture now.

codys8thcivicsi · 03-07-2007, 03:25 PM

are all reflash the same...is there a difference between hondata's and ajp's

reaper702 · 03-07-2007, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codys8thcivicsi

are all reflash the same...is there a difference between hondata's and ajp's

AJP's is for turbo which is done by Hondata aswell. The regular Hondata reflash is for your basic bolt-ons like intake, header, exhaust.

tommyroo · 03-07-2007, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skin441

Because it needs to breath when running with this setting. You r car does a million things at once you are unaware of. Reading from the MAF, i.e. temp, flow, barometrics, then to exhaust the burning of the fuel it then correspondds to timing and fuel delivery. Stock is for stock ecu. Moding is for Hondata reflash.
Opening up the motors program means giving it more air and allowing to release quicker. Go jog around the block..you feel good right. Well then go pound 2 red bulls and sprint with a paper bag over your mouth. getting a good picture now.

Then how come my car can breath in high cam from 5800K ->

If it can get enough air to run those RPMs I don't see how it can't get enough air in high cam at lower RPMs.

So your saying I couldn't tune my car to get a lower vtec point with something like the I/K-pro unless I put mods on my car? I just don't believe that.

reaper702 · 03-07-2007, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommyroo

Then how come my car can breath in high cam from 5800K ->

If it can get enough air to run those RPMs I don't see how it can't get enough air in high cam at lower RPMs.

So your saying I couldn't tune my car to get a lower vtec point with something like the I/K-pro unless I put mods on my car? I just don't believe that.

your car stock wouldn't be able to breathe as good as with intake/headers/exhaust as that is what they do. help the car breathe BETTER than stock and you need that kind of flow with the reflash or you will lose power as it wouldn't be breathing as it should. do you get it now?

tommyroo · 03-07-2007, 04:32 PM

Of course a car can breath better with an I/H/E.

By that logic my car shouldn't be able to perform well above 5800 stock. We all know it does. I'm just trying to understand why it wouldn't be able to breath find if the high cam mode was set lower on a stock car. You would obviously have to adjust the ECU and all it's monitoring components but if it handles vtec now I don't see it as a breathing problem.

Basically I think it could be done but Hondata is just taking the easy route and programming them to account for I/H/E because most people that would buy the product would already have such things on their car.

03-06-2007, 04:37 PM	#1 (permalink)
SoFLACiViCSi06 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Coral Springs Age: 25 Posts: 197 NFaz iTrader: 2 / 100%	Hondata Reflash Question I had a couple of people tell me with rsx's that with the hondata reflash you are lowering the RPM your vtec kicks in but the vtec doesnt pull as hard as it did before the reflash, is this true? Can someone with the reflash confirm this?

03-07-2007, 03:02 AM	#9 (permalink)
Skin441 Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: 661 Posts: 95 iTrader: 0 / 0%	I live about 40 minutes from Hondata. I rolled by there the other day. Great company, cool guys down there. They put some extensive research into these reflashes. They could make their own microsoft software down there. I can see it now "New PC company Hondata!" But anyways the v-tec surge is just not as prominent as it is stock because like stated in the million other threads on the reflash, when the vtec kicks in earlier the cam profile gradually builds up to where it makes its peak hp levels at high rpm's. What is gained though is the hp and torque gain getting from Hondata quote "Power is gained in the midrange from 4700rpm to 6300 rpm." Once original vtec point of 6,000 hits it has to build up which takes a bit longer. Thus all this means quicker acceleration, more linear power instead of instant hit, broader vtec range, and now a bad ass car. Just look at Hondata.com You can see the torque curve from 4700 is a nice gradual climb. This is were the motor is gaining a huge amount of acceleration. This is on my first list to do once I fit my r/t high flow cat and vibrant exhaust onto the ride in the next few months. Already have the injen cai. It is essential that you have exhaust mods this includes intake. More flow means revs build quicker and that dyno curve you see builds quicker. Some people over look acceleration rates I don't know why. Peak HP isn't always everything, torque is a huge thing to look at too. But how quickly your motor builds up to that peak HP/TQ numbers is when you see and feel huge improvements. 06civSi you won't be disappionted plus you will see the best gains possible like I said above. Really going to make the best of all those great investments you have made. For everyone else look plz at the hondata website they say everything needed to know. If anyone has any questions about this stuff let me know. I have been apart of extensive r&d testing, as a test rider, for both Yamaha and Honda involved in Motocross/Supercross motors. Well broke my back last year and am in the rehab process to come back and race the AMA Nationals this year. For a satellite yamaha team. Bought the si for a daily driver to from gym/shop/and mostly canyon runs and track. To take place of my stolen 06 R1. I have found myself along with my motor builder diving into it every day. Have to burn time some how. For the past 4 years have seen and heard a great deal. All the same principals apply for these motors just a few more cylinders/pistons/cam lobes. Can't wait to have my mechanic pull the head and port/ lap valves/ cut valve seats/ and such then see what we can get from this nice 2 liter. Last edited by Skin441; 03-07-2007 at 03:25 AM.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

LinkBacks (?) LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/bolt-ons-all-motor/31197-hondata-reflash-question.html
Posted By	For	Type	Date
Hondata reflash review - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum	This thread	Refback	12-26-2007 10:56 PM

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
33whp and 30wtq from hondata reflash and DCRH!!	06redsi	Civic SI	165	03-28-2009 01:21 AM
Hondata reflash question	Coop	Bolt-Ons And All-Motor	15	12-11-2006 01:06 AM
Hondata question	604_ep3	Forced Induction And Nitrous	0	11-24-2006 04:00 PM
Question for NJ SI owners with hondata reflash...	rcbm4	Forced Induction And Nitrous	1	09-07-2006 11:21 PM
Hondata Reflash	Tim	CorSport	14	07-26-2006 11:29 PM

03-06-2007, 04:44 PM	#2 (permalink)
BlkonBlkFG Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 157 iTrader: 1 / 100%	not true. Vtec is changed to a lower number to smoothen out the transition. This means you make more power earlier. You still feel the really hard pull around the same rpm level as stock, except now you make more power before it too.

03-06-2007, 04:50 PM	#3 (permalink)
*bossman* You will be missed TOBIE Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: :facepalming wussies: Posts: 21,737 PM whore. iTrader: 10 / 100%	It also may not seem like it's pulling as hard because rather than going from nothing to the stronger cams you have a little more pull before you actually get to where the secondary cams make the most power.

03-06-2007, 05:03 PM	#4 (permalink)
untouchablesi Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Toronto Age: 23 Posts: 358 David iTrader: 0 / 0%	i cant wait to get the reflash

03-06-2007, 05:54 PM	#5 (permalink)
King Bob Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Age: 27 Posts: 635 Houma, Louisiana iTrader: 1 / 100%	go to hondata's web site and take a look at the dyno comparrison. On a stock Si theis a huge dip in power right before vtec engagment, ths gives the illusion of a power surge at engagement. the reflash has no power dip therfore you wont notice that surge but you will actuallybe going faster.

03-06-2007, 09:45 PM	#7 (permalink)
Jardiniboy Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Waipahu, Hawaii Posts: 4,215 Jasten iTrader: 2 / 100%	The only thing about the reflash is that you would need at least a intake or exhaust

03-07-2007, 02:25 AM	#8 (permalink)
06civSi Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 512 iTrader: 2 / 100%	i cant wait. i get my ecu back from them tomorrow

03-07-2007, 12:15 PM	#10 (permalink)
06civSi Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 512 iTrader: 2 / 100%	thanks man. i cant wait. but the shitty thing is that i wake up this morning to like 3 inches of snow... i hate PA

03-07-2007, 12:35 PM	#11 (permalink)
SoFLACiViCSi06 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Coral Springs Age: 25 Posts: 197 NFaz iTrader: 2 / 100%	I have CAI and exhaust, thanks for clearing this up for me, i plan on sending out my ecu sometime this month for a reflash.

03-07-2007, 02:23 PM	#13 (permalink)
AznMTboy Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 85 iTrader: 0 / 0%	yea, the stock ECU program the fuel cut off for a second right before VTEC, to give it a stong KICK. So reflash you would get rid of that, well that the only to get to true power.

03-07-2007, 02:30 PM	#14 (permalink)
tommyroo Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Age: 36 Posts: 1,151 iTrader: 0 / 0%	I'm still a bit confused as to why our cars might lose power if the reflash is done with a pure stock car. Can't they just lower the vtec enagement point without screwing with other settings?

03-07-2007, 02:39 PM	#15 (permalink)
Skin441 Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: 661 Posts: 95 iTrader: 0 / 0%	Because it needs to breath when running with this setting. You r car does a million things at once you are unaware of. Reading from the MAF, i.e. temp, flow, barometrics, then to exhaust the burning of the fuel it then correspondds to timing and fuel delivery. Stock is for stock ecu. Moding is for Hondata reflash. Opening up the motors program means giving it more air and allowing to release quicker. Go jog around the block..you feel good right. Well then go pound 2 red bulls and sprint with a paper bag over your mouth. getting a good picture now.

03-07-2007, 03:25 PM	#16 (permalink)
codys8thcivicsi Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Central Florida Age: 23 Posts: 756 Cody Lopez iTrader: 0 / 0%	are all reflash the same...is there a difference between hondata's and ajp's

03-07-2007, 04:32 PM	#20 (permalink)
tommyroo Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Age: 36 Posts: 1,151 iTrader: 0 / 0%	Of course a car can breath better with an I/H/E. By that logic my car shouldn't be able to perform well above 5800 stock. We all know it does. I'm just trying to understand why it wouldn't be able to breath find if the high cam mode was set lower on a stock car. You would obviously have to adjust the ECU and all it's monitoring components but if it handles vtec now I don't see it as a breathing problem. Basically I think it could be done but Hondata is just taking the easy route and programming them to account for I/H/E because most people that would buy the product would already have such things on their car.