99 Mustang GT vs Civic Si

[Tastycakes]

That should be a nice race then if the 99-04 GT's run mid 14's and we're high 14's. I'd love to see the look on his face when he can barely beat a civic lol.

[ibanez37]

Auto's should be a fun race :)

[Sirbelch]

Originally Posted by Tastycakes

Yea we do have 100 hp per liter but we also hav 1/4 the torque so you cant really rip on em for not having 100 hp per liter. The LT1/LS1 makes 335-365 ft/lbs and the LS6 makes 406 ft/lbs (dunno what the mustangs have).

Mustangs are overrated tho. Back in the day it was much worse. Remember the 98 cobras w/ 320 hp that couldn't break into the 13's lol. And did you just say that 300 hp mustangs dyno at 220 hp to the wheels?

Yea i used to F*ck w/ ricers so bad back in the day, i feel bad now that i own one. The Si is a bad ass little car, finally w/ some balls, thats why i bought one. That and i can get over 15 MPG too =D. We may have bragging rights over other imports (excluding the turboed ones) but no we dont have bragging rights over V8's, so please dont try lol.

I read that the 98 cobras came with the wrong intake manafold from the factory and that manafold cut 50 hp out of the car. Once Ford found out, the cobras were back in the 13's.

My $0.02 having nothing to do with the above quote: The cliche "there is no replacement for displacement" is a cliche for a reason. If you put the same amount of equipment on two cars, the one with the more displacement will put out a lot more power and assuming they have the same "track" set up, the one with more power will win. Through my years of loving all cars, and small cars in paticular, i have met many import fans that way over rate their cars straight line perfromance. Its a shame that so many people are under read in a subject they claim to love soo much. Not just under read in the numbers department, but the amount of money it takes to get 100hp per L without FI. Only Honda, Porsche, Ferrari, and Lamborghini produce N/A engines that put out 100 hp per L. How much does a Porsche, Ferrari or Lamborghini cost? At leats 3 times more than a Mustang GT. I love imports for the twisties not the straights, the reliability and the gas mileage. If i wanted to go fast in a straight line, i'd own a mustang. A wise man once said, it is better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you are a fool than it is to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

[Blainestang]

Oh boy, civic_06_si is back

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

mustangs are not that fast.

Congratulations... this comment is so ridiculously vague that it is absolutely meaningless.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

no its not the drivers that cant drive

I find it interesting that you know how every single race that has ever occured plays out.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

Like others has said it doesnt matter much if the mustang shifts early it has a broad power band.

Wrong... Shift too early, and you're going to drop out of virtually any car's powerband. The Mustang's powerband may be borader than the Si's, but it's not as if the Mustang makes near-peak hp for 4k rpms or something... more like ~1500rpm, so a crappy shift is going to land you out of the powerband in a Mustang just like any other car.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

the civics you would have to keep it at a constant pace.

What the heck does that even mean?

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

those who said that their stang could run low 14s stock is lying. that cant be true.

Nope... I've done it, my friend has done it, (both with OK at best 60's and 80-90 degree weather, too), several other 99-04 GT's that were at the track the same night as my friend have done it, Evan Smith of Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords has gone high 13's, plenty of people on virtually every Mustang forum have done it. It's not that hard. Seriously, you're disagreeing with overwhelming evidence and absolutely everyone who knows what they're talking about AT ALL disagrees with you.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

the 03 stang mach 1 only clocks a 13.8 1/4 thats with 305 at the crank.

Wrong again... Mach 1's are capable of MUCH faster than 13.8. Picking one time out of a magazine doesn't really tell you what a car is capable of... Otherwise, all Si's would be running 15's just because one magazine driver had an off day.

Just so you know... the 13.8 you quoted from Motor Trend was for an AUTO Mach 1. In the same article it says:

Originally Posted by Motor Trend

We recently tested a Mach 1 five-speed and ran a 13.2 at 106.7.

So, the GT has 40 less hp than the 13.2-second Mach 1, but it runs "high 14's or low 15's"... Right.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

the gt only has 260 to the crank. remember they only dyno at 210 to the wheels. i beleive they still clock 15s to high 14s.

Physics doesn't care what you believe. Mach 1's are capable of low 13's, and GT's are not only CAPABLE of low 14's, they run them ALL THE TIME.
BTW, my slower-than-stock '00 V6 Mustang went 15.5, so I'm guessing the GT with 70hp more would be more than a couple tenths faster, too.
Basically, everything points to you having no clue what you're talking about.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

Never ever seen one that can go 13s without mods.

I've never seen an '06 Si run 14's, either, but since neither of us have seen every GT or Si ever, that argument doesn't hold much water. Fact is, BOTH have done so, so it doesn't matter what we have or haven't seen.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

mustangs are just like civics. Have to be modified to go alot faster.

Wait... in order to get my car to go "a lot faster", I have to modify it?!?!?! ....DANGIT!!!!

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

the stang is very strong and pulls hard but not fast. just look and pay attention to your mph and you will see that your car pulls hard but is fast like a civic.

That makes absolutely no sense.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

And to the people that says that they cannot catch traction on a stang is dumm.

Boy... a lot of people must be pretty DUMM, I guess. RWD is a better than FWD, that's for sure, but there's so much more that goes into traction capabilites it's not even funny. Not to mention, what does "catching traction" really mean? Sure, I can get traction slipping the clutch from 2k rpm, but there aren't too many street cars that are going to dead hook from a 6k clutch drop... whether it's a Mustang, a civic, whatever.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

it is hard to catch traction on any car that is a performer. but only on first gear. if you are not forced induction it is easy to catch traction. FF are harder to catch traction.

Wow... overgeneralize much. I can think of plenty of all-motor cars that have traction problems much worse than an Si.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

I have never seen a mustang that can burn out second and third and cant catch traction. the car is not strong enough to do that plus it is not FI. From what ive seen they are exactly like any performance car. it can only churp gears not burn like your in the rain.

Again with the "I've never seen it, so it COULDN'T POSSIBLY EXIST" argument.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

the mustang gts are overated.

Vague... Do you mean the power is literally overrated? Do you mean that the general public think they're faster than they really are? (In which case, you would be proof against that claim since you believe they run 15's and they actually run low 14's) Do you mean that their owners think they're faster than they really are? Vague

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

remember the civic is also fwd. and people are clocking times equaling the gts.

Oh really? Do you have a link to where a new Si went high 13's bone stock? I won't hold my breath.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

I guess the mustang owners are getting scared because the new civic is alot faster with bolt ons than the older one.

I would hope so. Most EP's needed bolt-ons to run the same times as my slower-than-stock '00 Mustang V6. No offence, but that's not a very solid argument.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

come on guys civic si doing close to high 13s with bolt ons.

Yeah... what's your point?

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

4 bangger and only 200WHP and 150tq. thats very impressive with a fwd.

Power-to-weight and gearing does wonders. It's Honda's philosophy and has been for a long time.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

imagine the civic with 300whp and your in the 12s. thats if you can catch traction.

Wonderful. I've seen Fox Mustangs go 12's w/ ~250whp... probably less. Like I said, power-to-weight, traction, and gearing.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

Mustangs are just too overated. 4.6 liter and only 300HP
civic is 2.0 liter and putting out 200HP.

It gets exponentially more difficult and therefore, expensive, to make 100hp/L as displacement goes up. Funny you don't mention the larger Honda engines, which don't even come close to 100hp/L. Why does Honda build a 3.5L V6 that makes "just" ~250hp when they could make that with a 2.0L. Hmm... maybe because people with Minivans and "trucks" don't want to rev to 7k to see that 250hp. It's just not the kind of engine that people want in a Minivan/Truck. Same deal with the Mustang. Mustang owners don't want a 3.0L 300hp V6. They want lots of torque, power all over the rpm range, a V8 soundtrack, and they don't want to pay a lot of money for it. So, Ford builds them exactly what they want, and they build a 300hp sports coupe for less money than anybody else. Ford is in the business of selling cars, and if they built that 3.0L 300hp V6, sure, that would be a good engine, but it doesn't fit the Mustang philosophy.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

which one is more impressive. the civic right.

Depends on what impresses you. If specific output floats your boat, great. However, if you just like to make good power for little money and don't care if you're driving something with less than 100hp/L, then the Mustang is a great buy.

Originally Posted by civic_06_si

never seen a american car that is able to put out what it should. 4.6 liter should have at least 400HP N/A not force induction. GT500 stang doesnot count. another example is the 6.0 liter pontiac gto. Only has 400hp. should have at least 600hp. bigger is suppose to be better.

By that logic, a 3.5L V6 should have 350hp, a 2.4L should have 240hp, and so on. Even Honda realizes that sometimes it's cheaper and more fitting for the application to use displacement to make more hp/$ and sacrifice a little hp/L.

[jameslewis178]

well i do low 14's with a stock si. and with springs, short shifter, and shift bushings my times have improved even more. i have only lost to 1 mustang and it was a mach 1 and it was only by a car lenght and i was in a shitty lane with dirt in it (street racing). evey gt i race i own it by 2-3 car lenghts. usually i think its the drivers in the mustangs but after about 5 races im starting to think its just the mustang.

also i do hook on the street from a 5800rpm launch. (when there isnt dirt in the road.
i have proof on videos but i just have to get my friends to put them on there myspace.

[ibanez37]

You must have been racing a lot of autos...or someone put an F20 in your engine bay. These are all from a dig?

[Anubis]

Damn these threads I just can't help myself with all the b/s flyin around. civic_06_si please stop trying to make your arguments about GT's you have no idea what you are talking about, and most importantly make no sense at all. There has been several threads now of you saying the same crap over and over......you are wrong deal with it. Your friends stock GSR did not and will not beat any 99-04 GT period sorry unless of course as I said before the Gt driver has one leg and one arm and drives a MT . The day I see Gt's running 15s as you claim your Si will probably be in the 16's.

You should have stopped with the first few threads as myself and many others were begging for you to. Just give it up damn....or have you not been enough then please continue and I will continue to correct you.

[Anubis]

Originally Posted by jameslewis178

well i do low 14's with a stock si. and with springs, short shifter, and shift bushings my times have improved even more. i have only lost to 1 mustang and it was a mach 1 and it was only by a car lenght and i was in a shitty lane with dirt in it (street racing). evey gt i race i own it by 2-3 car lenghts. usually i think its the drivers in the mustangs but after about 5 races im starting to think its just the mustang.

also i do hook on the street from a 5800rpm launch. (when there isnt dirt in the road.
i have proof on videos but i just have to get my friends to put them on there myspace.

I would love to see a video, but regardless the average stock Si will lose to the average stock 99-04 GT everytime. I own both cars I know which is faster with out a doubt. My 04 GT will take my Si easily from a stop, and less from a roll but will still win.

[jameslewis178]

they were all from a dig. maybe i just drive my car like it is supposed to be driven. it takes a hell of a driver to do fast times in the civic. were its not so much of the driver in a mustang.

i like the mustang but would never own one, i drive them everyday at work and even when i drive them i think there faster because of the torque but ever time i race 1 i win with only loseing to 1 because of traction. i even thought my moms 06 auto v6 would beat my si till i raced it and won by 5+ car lenghts.
anyways my cars for sale so i can get a evo. then i will never here the evo vs gt shit.

[ibanez37]

Originally Posted by jameslewis178

they were all from a dig. maybe i just drive my car like it is supposed to be driven. it takes a hell of a driver to do fast times in the civic. were its not so much of the driver in a mustang.

i like the mustang but would never own one, i drive them everyday at work and even when i drive them i think there faster because of the torque but ever time i race 1 i win with only loseing to 1 because of traction. i even thought my moms 06 auto v6 would beat my si till i raced it and won by 5+ car lenghts.
anyways my cars for sale so i can get a evo. then i will never here the evo vs gt shit.

Sorry to hear. Why you selling?

Anubis, for some reason you look familiar in these Mustang threads, but seem to have forgotten you had a stang. What all you got done? Year/Trim/Color? I just remember you from the RT cat GB and pulling through with the wifey dishing out some consquences LOL.

[Anubis]

Originally Posted by ibanez37

Anubis, for some reason you look familiar in these Mustang threads, but seem to have forgotten you had a stang. What all you got done? Year/Trim/Color? I just remember you from the RT cat GB and pulling through with the wifey dishing out some consquences LOL.

I have added my .2 cents frequently in these mustang threads as I know better than most of what is being said. I have a 07 si and a 04 40th ann. conv. white stang GT with a tan top and two toned interior. It is a very nice car, and it has the chrome 5 spoke rims too. It is stock as it is my wifes DD. Plenty of power down low IMO overall a great car we love it.

[ibanez37]

Originally Posted by Anubis

I have added my .2 cents frequently in these mustang threads as I know better than most of what is being said. I have a 07 si and a 04 40th ann. conv. white stang GT with a tan top and two toned interior. It is a very nice car, and it has the chrome 5 spoke rims too. It is stock as it is my wifes DD. Plenty of power down low IMO overall a great car we love it.

I figured that's where else I saw you. You have good taste Man how I miss that power sometimes. Looks amazing as well. I love white verts, but the tan top would have to be black. Thanks again for getting the GB finished!

[Anubis]

Originally Posted by ibanez37

Thanks again for getting the GB finished!

No problem thanks for the rep! here is to waiting for the R/T cat

[dsg2003gt]

Originally Posted by jameslewis178

they were all from a dig. maybe i just drive my car like it is supposed to be driven. it takes a hell of a driver to do fast times in the civic. were its not so much of the driver in a mustang.

i like the mustang but would never own one, i drive them everyday at work and even when i drive them i think there faster because of the torque but ever time i race 1 i win with only loseing to 1 because of traction. i even thought my moms 06 auto v6 would beat my si till i raced it and won by 5+ car lenghts.
anyways my cars for sale so i can get a evo. then i will never here the evo vs gt shit.

wrong.

[SIcBoy]

raced a gt99 from a 40 roll
yesturday he sounded mean but,(he had exhaust fo sho)
he couldnt pull on me, we were neck and neck, i think he was mad when he figuered he couldnt be me... funny thing is i dont think he knew we lived in the same neighborhood

[jameslewis178]

Originally Posted by ibanez37

Sorry to hear. Why you selling?

Anubis, for some reason you look familiar in these Mustang threads, but seem to have forgotten you had a stang. What all you got done? Year/Trim/Color? I just remember you from the RT cat GB and pulling through with the wifey dishing out some consquences LOL.

i want a mid $30k car like a evo or s2000

[ibanez37]

Originally Posted by jameslewis178

i want a mid $30k car like a evo or s2000

No STI? I've been a STi fan boy for a while, but my friend has an 04 EVO in the light blue. Nice car and pretty quick. Look great, but the 05 STi's still are the best. Still can't get into the 06+ STi's, and it looks as though the 08's are going to be horrible. Good luck the with purchase either way! Keep us updated.

[Johnbro]

i was riding with my friend yesterday. He has a 2002 RSX Type S with intake and exhaust and he beat a new manual gt by like 4 cars. I don't know if the dude couldn't drive or what, because i could hear him trying. They raced for maybe 1/4 or a little more

[jameslewis178]

the guy in the mustang must have drove like a panzey! i walk all over 02 rsx's with the mods you mentioned with no problem.